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01-05-2018, 06:24 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Seattle, Washington
Trailer: 17b - 2017 model
Posts: 334
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Driving on ice and snow - bad idea?
How many of you tow your trailers when ice and snow are on the roads? Any tips on driving safely in these conditions, or is it something that would be best avoided?
It’s snowing here in the mountains, and it’s rather tempting to bring the trailer up to a ski area for the weekend.
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01-05-2018, 06:25 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Seattle, Washington
Trailer: 17b - 2017 model
Posts: 334
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One thing that occurred to me was that if the brakes on the tow vehicle were better than the brakes on the trailer, which is probably a good assumption, then the trailer would want to jackknife during a stop if the trailer wasn't directly behind the vehicle, like during a turn. I was thinking it might be good to increase the trailer brakes up to their maximum when driving in snow. Ideally, if the trailer brakes were stronger than the tow vehicle brakes, it would tend to straighten the two together in a straight line rather than jackknifing them together.
I don't think it's realistic to get the trailer brake stronger than the tow vehicle's, but I was thinking the stronger they could be the better.
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01-05-2018, 06:40 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Southwick, Massachusetts
Trailer: None, sold my 2014 5.0TA
Posts: 7,124
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I avoid it. Heading east on 70 in CO I pulled over and spent the night in Grand Junction to avoid it snowing in the Mts. I also take the southern most route heading west en route to AZ in the winter.
__________________
Happy Motoring
Bob
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01-05-2018, 06:49 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Fenton, Michigan
Trailer: 2018 Escape 21, 2014 Northern Lite slide in, 2014 2500 Duramax
Posts: 185
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Not something to do knowingly
I have been caught out and had to though, but if it was glaze ice set in place wherever you are.
I now carry a set of tire chains fit for the trailer, as well as for all 4 wheels on the truck. Just in case I "have" to move.
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01-05-2018, 06:52 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: North of Danbury, Wisconsin
Trailer: 2018 Escape 21C
Posts: 3,033
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Yes we have towed our trailer when there was snow on the road or when it was actively snowing or when it was snowing and 7blowing or when there was a chance of snow.
The only time we ever got stuck was on the mountain in Amicalola SP in Georgia . ( They didn't have a snow plow )
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01-05-2018, 06:58 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Trailer: 2017 Escape 5.0 TA
Posts: 15,532
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I do it all the time, and have no issue with it in the least. If I wanted to tow to a ski hill I certainly would, unless conditions were really bad.
I think it is a bad idea to increase the trailer brakes higher than they should be, as you do not want them locking up, this will cause skidding more than if they were allowed to roll.
The trailer will follow nicely behind the tow vehicle including braking. The only time I have ever have any concern is going fast on tight turns, where the trailer will tend to want to swing wide if it is slippery.
The biggest concern on snow or ice is when changing from the direction your momentum is taking you, just as accelerating, braking or turning. If you keep going straight, unless it is absolutely glare ice, you will just keep going straight until you do something to change this steady pace.
But, just as I posted in the trailer pickup thread, one needs to be comfortable with towing under these conditions, or at least work at practising, otherwise they should avoid it if at all possible.
__________________
2017 Escape 5.0 TA
2015 Ford F150 Lariat 3.5L EcoBoost
2009 Escape 19 (previous)
“Most folks are about as happy as they make up their minds to be.” — Abraham Lincoln
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01-06-2018, 04:21 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulk
One thing that occurred to me was that if the brakes on the tow vehicle were better than the brakes on the trailer, which is probably a good assumption, then the trailer would want to jackknife during a stop if the trailer wasn't directly behind the vehicle, like during a turn. I was thinking it might be good to increase the trailer brakes up to their maximum when driving in snow. Ideally, if the trailer brakes were stronger than the tow vehicle brakes, it would tend to straighten the two together in a straight line rather than jackknifing them together.
I don't think it's realistic to get the trailer brake stronger than the tow vehicle's, but I was thinking the stronger they could be the better.
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This is a habit used often in semi trailers, the truck driver wants to use the trailer brakes before using his own, less wear and tear on the tractor and more on the trailer which often is owned by someone else. In addition as mentioned, a stronger pull from the rear would keep things in line.
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
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01-06-2018, 07:56 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Trailer: 2017 Escape 5.0 TA
Posts: 15,532
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008
This is a habit used often in semi trailers, the truck driver wants to use the trailer brakes before using his own, less wear and tear on the tractor and more on the trailer which often is owned by someone else. In addition as mentioned, a stronger pull from the rear would keep things in line.
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Truckers used to do this when using there tractor to tow contract trailers to save their truck brakes. It put excessive wear on the trailer brakes and tires as they often locked up. Locking any trailer brake on snowy or icy roads is not a good idea at all, as it loses the directional stability rolling tires possess.
Keeping the trailer tires rolling along, even while braking, is a good thing. Locking them up not so much. If the trailer had chains then harder braking would not cause a skid. If I was in a position where trailer chains were required, I would likely not bother travelling then unless absolutely necessary.
__________________
2017 Escape 5.0 TA
2015 Ford F150 Lariat 3.5L EcoBoost
2009 Escape 19 (previous)
“Most folks are about as happy as they make up their minds to be.” — Abraham Lincoln
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01-06-2018, 08:46 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Southern Alberta, Alberta
Trailer: 2015 Escape 5.0TA
Posts: 1,734
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Driving in snow and ice conditions are 2 different things. I had no problems dragging my trailer through snow, truck in 4 HI when I lived in Northern BC. Snow driving the trailer I found was pretty much a dead weight when dragging through snow.
Ice driving is entirely different as anyone who’s driven/played around on a frozen lake knows, you have pretty much zero control hard braking or turning, I won’t tow if it’s on ice.
Cheers
Doug
__________________
Cheers
Doug
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01-06-2018, 09:09 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: North of Danbury, Wisconsin
Trailer: 2018 Escape 21C
Posts: 3,033
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Two things to learn when driving in snow
1) If going up hill never completely let off on the gas , if you slow down / stop you may end up backing down the hill.
2) Stop signs are only for when someone else is comming
Slow down just a little , look both ways and then if it's clear just keep on going right through the intersection.
If you stop at a stop sign there's a good chance you will get rear ended or the guy behind you will have to stop and end up stuck .
Prepare to get a lecture on learning to drive in snow.
Driving in snow is a skill that really isn't that hard to comprehend
You don't want to get stuck so you just have to KEEP MOVING .
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01-06-2018, 11:38 AM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: North Van., British Columbia
Trailer: 2014 Escape 19, sold; 2019 Escape 21, Sept. 2019
Posts: 8,743
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PGDriver
Ice driving is entirely different as anyone who’s driven/played around on a frozen lake knows, you have pretty much zero control hard braking or turning,
Cheers
Doug
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I used to race a sports car on a frozen lake. That's when I learned that the snow plowed to clear the ice wasn't a large mound of soft fluffy stuff.
Ron
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01-06-2018, 11:39 AM
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#12
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Oswego, New York
Trailer: 2017 Escape 21C, 2018 Ford F150
Posts: 5,363
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Since I live in a part of the country that gets 150" - 200" of snow per winter, I have had many years of experience. On top of that, while in college I had a vacation job of plowing a private lake with a jeep so the owners could skate (i.e., no chains allowed).
Steve gave some good suggestions, but I'd add one - even with all my experience, I wouldn't tow a trailer in snow or ice unless I had to. And, if I did, I would not increase the braking on the trailer - there is too much of a chance of the trailer wheels locking, causing it to skid. I've towed brakeless trailers on both ice & snow without problems, but they were always far lighter than even my Escape 17.
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01-06-2018, 12:07 PM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Smithers, BC, British Columbia
Trailer: Escape 21, July 2018 delivery
Posts: 322
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As I mentioned in the winter delivery thread, the problem is that the tug will almost certainly have tires with better grip than the trailer, and the tug brakes will nowadays likely be enhanced by an ABS system. This, combined with the electronic brake controller for the trailer will pretty much guarantee that the trailer wheels will lock up on slippery roads before the tug wheels do, leading to a potentially dangerous jackknife. On level ground, this problem is controllable by avoiding the need, ever, to brake hard. Easier said than done given other drivers sharing the road, but as others have pointed out, doable.
On steep hills with curves, like most ski hill access, a whole different game. You no longer get to decide when and how hard you have to brake, the hill and turns decide for you. I might be able to tow a heavy trailer up our local hill here in Smithers, but there is no way I would try to descend without chains on the trailer.
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01-06-2018, 02:38 PM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Southern Alberta, Alberta
Trailer: 2015 Escape 5.0TA
Posts: 1,734
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron in BC
I used to race a sports car on a frozen lake. That's when I learned that the snow plowed to clear the ice wasn't a large mound of soft fluffy stuff.
Ron
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I know exactly what your saying, its even worse on a modified dirt bike [emoji41]
Cheers
Doug
__________________
Cheers
Doug
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01-06-2018, 09:11 PM
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#15
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Fenton, Michigan
Trailer: 2018 Escape 21, 2014 Northern Lite slide in, 2014 2500 Duramax
Posts: 185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PGDriver
I know exactly what your saying, its even worse on a modified dirt bike [emoji41]
Cheers
Doug
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I used to ice race also, tractionized tires at the start and studded near the end.
Met the snow piles and straw bales a few times learned a lot about traction on snow vs ice, fun times
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01-06-2018, 11:53 PM
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#16
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Juneau, Alaska
Trailer: 2015 17A - Ready for more Maiden Voyages ....
Posts: 881
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Driving in snow shouldn't drive a stake of fear into your heart ..... the question should be asked ..."What kind of snow?" The Eskimos have 200 words for snow ( ok ... ok I made that number up) but there really are many types of snow. I grew up in Washington State (West side) and there the snow has a very high water content ... so when it packs down, its still white like snow but has the traction equivalency of ice. ... slightly better than sheet or even black ice but not much. It usually falls when the temperature is only slightly above 32 degrees F or down to about 30F. Snow that has fallen much below that in temperature tends to be 'dry snow' and has the traction equivalency of say a light gravel on the roadway and compared to 'wet snow' is very forgiving regarding turning and stopping. Still a lot of caution should be added in regards to speed, following distance and (for the conditions) high speed turns.
Snow that falls in the lower 20's - particulary in the Rockies can add another driving point of interest. This is powder snow and usually has a reasonable amount of traction ... its squeaky and crunchy to walk on. Of course slow your speed and try to avoid sharp braking and turns. The new condition here can have a VERY interesting additional quality. As the road gets plowed (hurray) the side blade of the plow can also plow the shoulder. In powder snow conditions, that plowed shoulder can become level with the rest of the roadway .... well .... that is OK until the plow has enough surplus snow to fill the roadside drainage ditch and make it level with the rest of the road surface. Puff off or swerve here and you'll be looking up at the road when you very shortly stop.
Winter travel requires a lot more concentration and caution but does not have to be an ordeal ... especially with proper preparation. Something often overlooked is - bring extra blankets or better yet sleeping bags in case you become stuck for a while in cold temperatures.
One year while driving down from Alaska, late April, I found myself on a mountain pass ... somewhat steep down slope. Off to the side in generous pullouts were vehicles pulling trailers and it looked like they were camped until the snow plow could come by and clear the road ... I was sooo jealous... the yellow interior trailer lights looked inviting . I was driving at the time through a slush and snow mix deeper than the undercarriage of my Jeep Cherokee (not towing) ... I found that if I kept my speed up to 40 - 45 my momentum would keep me from being throughn about by the tire ruts from the previous vehicles. All was well, sorta until an 18 wheeler going the other direction swerved partially into my lane ... almost instantly it swerved back but I was hit by a 'wake' of snow and slush from his tires and became unable to see out my windshield. At the same time I felt a huge concussion of air hit my face and I readied myself for the impact of a lapful of snow and water. It didn't ... my windshield held but I wasn't able to see for a few seconds til my wipers could clear a small area to see ... felt like it took forever. When it cleared a bit, I found I was still in my lane and slowing. Shortly, an apparition appeared ... no it wasn't the face of Mary or Jesus ... it was a parking lot and I pulled in and waited until my heart rate slowed to below 300. I got out of my car and it was covered by 6 - 12 " of dirty road slush. I'm lucky to be alive!
Even luckier because the parking lot I pulled into belonged to the "Toad River Lodge.". There I got a hot meal and was able to get a room for the night. Sometimes everything works out just right! Besides, I'm too old to die young.
I'm sure lots of you BC guys will know the lodge I'm talking about. Its a favorite stop of mine whenever I'm traveling either north or south. I recommend stopping there. Even if you are not fighting the weather ... very beautiful location and friendly people!
Tom
www.toadriverlodge.com
(I have no relationship with these folks ... wish I did)
__________________
Consciousness: That confusing time between naps
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01-07-2018, 12:32 AM
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#17
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Steveston B.C., British Columbia
Trailer: 2012- 17'B.... 2016 Tacoma SR5 TRD
Posts: 504
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Been there in the summer . Nice place to hang your hat.
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I've almost been everywhere man.
Almost been everywhere.....
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01-07-2018, 01:06 AM
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#18
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: North Vancouver, British Columbia
Trailer: 2009 Escape 17B 2020 Toyota Highlander XLE
Posts: 17,136
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Drove the two-lane highway between Cache Creek and Kamloops in a blizzard, in the company Dodge Neon.
Found myself being tailed by a semi, and he obviously wanted to pass, but I couldn't tell where the shoulder became ditch. The snow was hypnotic, illuminated by the headlights of the semi, which were probably two feet above the roof of the Neon. I couldn't pull over and only occasionally spotted the centre line.
As a news photographer, I've had to drive in all sorts of conditions to get to the story, but, I've never felt more helpless or afraid for my life.
Now that I have a choice, if there is a threat, I'll just stay put.
__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
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01-07-2018, 03:23 PM
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#19
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Denison, Texas
Trailer: 2015 21'; 2011 19' sold; 4Runner; ph ninezero3 327-27ninefour
Posts: 5,136
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I found just on a driveway with a little incline that four-wheel drive makes a big difference. We could get the four-wheel up through a lot of snow. Need a running start though and not driving slowly. We could clear the snow and put sand, and still, the non-four-wheel might not make it.
On the road, not too much problem driving on snow around town. Ice is entirely impossible. If you are going on highways though, that changes it for the worse. I would avoid driving with any such forecasts in the first place, if at all possible.
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Cathy. Floating Cloud
"Live in the sunshine, swim the sea, drink the wild air.... "
Emerson
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01-07-2018, 03:29 PM
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#20
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Site Team
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Mid Left Coast, California
Trailer: 2014 Escape 21
Posts: 5,121
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IMHO, good tires makes as much of a difference as 4x4. my Tacoma 4x4 has BFG All-Terrain KO2 tires, fairly new. I almost never have to put it in 4H as its really sure footed. my friend has a tundra 4x4, also TRD Off Road, but he has highway tires, and even in 4x4 he's slipping and sliding all over on loose stuff.
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