First time 21' observations……and emergency cable discussion - Page 7 - Escape Trailer Owners Community
Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×

Go Back   Escape Trailer Owners Community > Escape Me | General Topics > General Escape
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 01-18-2014, 12:07 PM   #121
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,830
WD-40 is mineral oil and solvent, intended as a water-displacing fluid for rust prevention, but somewhat useful to free stuck stuff and (if a better solvent is not handy) to clean some mechanical devices. I'm pretty sure that it has no silicone in it, which is supported by the corresponding Wikipedia page and the manufacturer's FAQ:
Quote:
While the ingredients in WD-40 Multi-Use Product are secret, we can tell you what it does NOT contain. WD-40 Multi-Use Product does not contain silicone, kerosene, water, graphite, or chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs).
There is now a line of products under the WD-40 brand, called "WD-40 Specialist", which includes a silicone lubricant; this is not the product sold simply as "WD-40". The WD-40 Specialist Water Resistant Silicone Lubricant is clearly labeled as such.

The problem with WD-40 and dirt collection is simply the oil component. Put any oil on anything, leave it exposed to the air, and it will accumulate the bits of dirt that are always blowing around. In my experience, silicone lubricants are no worse, and likely better in this respect; indeed, as Jim explained and the WD-40 Specialist silicone product claims:
Quote:
It dries fast and leaves a clear, non-staining film that doesn’t stick or make a mess, so it won’t attract dirt.
There are very few places I use WD-40 without following it up with a more complete cleaning or a different and more suitable lubricant; I don't want it left on anything. I use a silicone lubricant on automotive body seals and in locks.
__________________

Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 12:09 PM   #122
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,830
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeonW View Post
Brian, I wasn't suggesting skipping the chains, safety checks, etc. just trying to understand what effect a WDH would have in all these scenarios.
I understand that; I'm just suggesting not to expect any net benefit of the WD system as a backup in case the primary methods fail.
__________________

Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 12:44 PM   #123
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,830
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
to continue the safety chain discussion, I'm thinking about a set of these
Cables (instead of chains) can certainly work, but my concern with them is that they are not readily adjustable in length, and if they are too long then the trailer's tongue will not be held up or well controlled if they are ever needed. These cables are normally coiled, so they don't drag on the ground, but that can just mask the fact that they are too long.

I noticed that all of the cables in The Trailer Shoppe Safety Chain and Hooks page are 40" (one metre) long, which would be way too long for my trailer and tug... and likely for most rigs. It's not just the Curt brand cables at that retailer: eTrailer lists another brand at the same length (plus a bunch of special-purpose cables that are much shorter or much longer, but need to be for towbar use).

Chains are heavy and can be awkward, but with the wide variety of available hardware they can be easily tailored to the correct length and desired end fittings. Cable is much harder to work with, although easy to use once set up.
Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 01:49 PM   #124
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 579
Cpaharley,
I would rethink the cable idea for several reasons.
Cable swages can give way without warning if you have no testing capability of the wire rope in the swage or under that vinyl coating. You could measure the cable length for stretch however, you also have to measure diameter for stretch and or broken core wire. The vinyl coating prevents this or you have to scrape it off making the protection it afforded useless. Chains you can visually inspect for stretch, flattened links, corrosion, cracks etc and length generally a change of Ľ” in length indicates time to replace but it is variable.
Cables are subject to internal corrosion yes even galvanized cable will do to rubbing internally, the vinyl coating will slow it but water will work its way in eventually. Chains corrode but you can visually inspect and either oil or replace when needed.
The vinyl coating will be stiff in cold weather, crack eventually on the radiuses etc. Chain used for this purpose can be galvanized or stainless to prevent corrosion the galvanized coating will wear through after a while but there is not loss of integrity of the chain. Stainless well is EXPEN$IVE!!!!
If you drag a cable you have little to no noise and it will require replacement from a very short drag VS chain.
When cables stretch such as when turning every stretch induces stress on the strands and at the swages thereby, reducing its life expectancy. Without the proper inspection tools and knowledge you run the risk of catastrophic failure if your trailer was to become un- hitched and land on them.
Just my opinion as working in different fields with chains and cable I have seen far more cable break unexpectedly then chain.
If you really want to see what a pain it is to deal with cable use and inspection check here:
http://static.e-publishing.af.mil/production/1/af_se/publication/afi91-203/afi91-203.pdf
Page 739 Is the inspection requirements though only generalized.
Or Here:
http://www.imca-int.com/media/73533/imcam194.pdf
A shorter course on wire rope then the military one :}
http://www.bridon.com/usa/x/downloads/oilfield/BAC_technical.pdf

As for greasing the stabilizers I use screw jack grease similar to this Castrol Tribol 4020/460-2 I say similar as I have forgotten where I picked up the can I have and the label is worn off. It is rated for high heat and low cold along with maintaining its viscosity under compression.
Again just my opinion they make lubricants for specific applications and I generally try to use what is recommended.

Cypher
Cypherian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 02:59 PM   #125
Site Team
 
cpaharley2008's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,011
Myron,
Do you recall what length chain you shorten yours to? In your pictures it appears you have about 6 links free?
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
cpaharley2008 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 05:46 PM   #126
Senior Member
 
MyronL's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: ..., New Mexico
Trailer: 2013 Esc19/'14 Silvrado
Posts: 4,042
Correct, with the 6th link from the end of Escapes' chain install being connected to the QuickLink thing, which you see is connected right to the hitch.

Because my picture #3 indicates this set up creates a dangerously low cradle for a jumped-off coupler -tube being half an inch to the ground (!) - seems imperative must shorten up that chain slack. I'll know in a few days when I hitch up again what will work best. Will continue using the Escape QuickLink, but will link it up somewhere onto the chain instead of onto the hitch.
__________________
Myron
"A billion here, a billion there...add it all up and before you know it you're talking real money." Everett Dirkson
MyronL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 07:08 PM   #127
Site Team
 
cpaharley2008's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,011
So what is the length of the chain "in use" if you do not mind? Thanks.
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
cpaharley2008 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 07:32 PM   #128
Senior Member
 
MyronL's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: ..., New Mexico
Trailer: 2013 Esc19/'14 Silvrado
Posts: 4,042
Chain is 32˝ inches long.
__________________
Myron
"A billion here, a billion there...add it all up and before you know it you're talking real money." Everett Dirkson
MyronL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 07:37 PM   #129
Site Team
 
cpaharley2008's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,011
So, according to your in use number , you want to shorten it by one link, the ideal length would be around 30" inches? Thanks for measuring, Myron. Stay warm.
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
cpaharley2008 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 07:47 PM   #130
Senior Member
 
MyronL's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: ..., New Mexico
Trailer: 2013 Esc19/'14 Silvrado
Posts: 4,042
Wait wait. I may have misunderstood you. The entire chain, end to end, is 32˝ inches long. When I hitch up I will slip it through the hitch and attach the end of it back somewhere on the chain using the quickLink connector. Don't know what the "working length, i.e. from hitch to under the tongue, will be until I evaluate the proper slack to allow free turning without binding. Guessing that to likely be more than one, probably 2 to 4 chain links - but we shall see.
__________________
Myron
"A billion here, a billion there...add it all up and before you know it you're talking real money." Everett Dirkson
MyronL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 08:27 PM   #131
Senior Member
 
JohnB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia
Trailer: 2012 15A
Posts: 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
to continue the safety chain discussion, I'm thinking about a set of these
I bought a set of those cables thinking it would be faster to connect the trailer. Ended up not installing them.
When I finally looked at the existing chain connection to the trailer I realized that the end chain link is looped onto a solid round bar which is welded in place on the trailer. Would have to torch off the chain and connect the cable with a chain link or some other method. That or cut the bar, slide on the cable loop and then re-weld the bar back.

What I would like to do is add a solid spacer onto the bar to keep the chains to the outside ends of the bar, left and right sides. They tend to migrate towards the center of the bar. I think that with the chains kept apart it would be a better geometric layout should the chains ever have to support a decoupled trailer. Just a thought!
JohnB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 09:17 AM   #132
Site Team
 
cpaharley2008's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,011
OK, I understand, thanks. So I'm estimating 25" working length, until it is confirmed. I'm trying to determine if a 24" coil or some other arrangement will work that appears to be "custom" made for the correct length. Then work on the power and emergency cords.
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
cpaharley2008 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 02:12 PM   #133
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,830
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnB View Post
When I finally looked at the existing chain connection to the trailer I realized that the end chain link is looped onto a solid round bar which is welded in place on the trailer...

What I would like to do is add a solid spacer onto the bar to keep the chains to the outside ends of the bar, left and right sides. They tend to migrate towards the center of the bar. I think that with the chains kept apart it would be a better geometric layout should the chains ever have to support a decoupled trailer.
I have only a vague memory of seeing this arrangement, but I think I understand: the two chains are both on the same bar which is welded to the tongue (on the bottom of the tongue, if I recall correctly).

This is not good for two reasons:
  1. the chains are not spread apart to create the X-shaped "cradle" that is desired to keep the tongue up if the chains are ever needed (and indeed if you hook them up in an X they will be pulled toward each other)
  2. more importantly (in my opinion) the anchoring arrangements are not independent, so if the bar breaks or its weld fails on one side then both chains come off.

Rather than modify this arrangement to keep the chains apart, I think I would ditch it entirely and make new anchor points for the chains, one per side.
Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 02:29 PM   #134
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,830
Quote:
Originally Posted by MyronL View Post
When I hitch up I will slip it through the hitch and attach the end of it back somewhere on the chain using the quickLink connector.
Why? So you can adjust working length for different tow vehicles, perhaps? To avoid cutting off excess chain length?

My older Boler has weird hardware on the end of each chain which only links into the same chain, so I need to double it back this way and hook it in a position which gives the right working length. This means that if the chains ever need to do their job, all the force will be against the side of a chain link, which will be weak compared to a properly attached fitting.

There are lots of forms of hooks (or just quick links, depending on the hitch's chain loop design) which can directly connect to the chain loop. I would rather use one of them attached to the correct chain link so that hook on the end of the chain is simply snapped onto the chain loop - right length every time, with every part of the system properly loaded. This is how my utility trailer is set up.

Rental trailers (U-Haul, specifically) routinely use Myron's method of looping through the hitch's chain loop and hooking back on themselves, but they need to be long with a way to take up the slack, due to the wide range of hitch arrangements. They typically use a grab hook for this purpose; grab hooks slip over a single link and stay in that position on the chain, but unfortunately they almost never have a safety latch so a quick link is more secure.
Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 05:22 PM   #135
Site Team
 
cpaharley2008's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,011
To handle the issue re: where the chains are attached to the trailer via a bar and the ends can move, install a piece of rubber hose split down the middle between the chains, that will keep them apart and give you your triangle opening. an old trick
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
cpaharley2008 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 06:58 PM   #136
Senior Member
 
MyronL's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: ..., New Mexico
Trailer: 2013 Esc19/'14 Silvrado
Posts: 4,042
"Why? So you can adjust working length for different tow vehicles, perhaps? To avoid cutting off excess chain length?"

Yep. Why cut chains down and then not be able to adjust working slack length to the tow vehicle(s). True that does mean every time I chain-up I gotta remember what linkage works best. I'm fine with that.
__________________
Myron
"A billion here, a billion there...add it all up and before you know it you're talking real money." Everett Dirkson
MyronL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 07:33 PM   #137
Senior Member
 
gbaglo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: North Vancouver, British Columbia
Trailer: 2009 Escape 17B 2020 Toyota Highlander XLE
Posts: 17,130
I keep forgetting to mark the links on my WDH. Is it hooked on third link? Or three links hanging?
__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
gbaglo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 08:59 PM   #138
Senior Member
 
Sandra L's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Antelope, California
Trailer: 2009 17B "Suite Escape" pulled by a 2020 Toyota Sienna
Posts: 1,555
Glenn, I solved that dilemma by using nail polish! I bought bright pink stuff at the dollar store and painted the proper link. I have touched it up a bit over the years, but there is no question and no memory effort!
__________________
Peace and Sunshine
Sandra L is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 09:09 PM   #139
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Portland, Oregon
Trailer: 2013 15B
Posts: 124
Glenn: I use a red cable tie to mark the link. Works great and won't wear off.
__________________
Jim and Robin
15B
Jeep Liberty
JimJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 09:26 PM   #140
Senior Member
 
gbaglo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: North Vancouver, British Columbia
Trailer: 2009 Escape 17B 2020 Toyota Highlander XLE
Posts: 17,130
Excellent. Thank you.
__________________

__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
gbaglo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Escape Trailer Industries or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:35 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2012 Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.
×