Ford F150 Letdown and warning

[ESCAPERS]

I bought a new Tundra in 2002 (it's a 2003), still have it and have never done anything to it except front brakes which I just did. It just keeps running. I payed $18k for it.
I also have a 2002 Nissan Pathfinder that I bought new in 2001 and have yet to even put brakes on it. It too just keeps running.

[jkoenig24]

Hmmm. Sounds like FORD is going back to the days of:

Fix
Or
Repair
Daily

and / or

Found
On
Road
Dead

[Ron in BC]

I've had absolutely great experiences with both Mazda and Toyota. My wife would probably still be driving her 1998 Corolla if our niece hadn't needed a car and we had a surplus of vehicles. The niece drove the crap out it until last year and still it drove almost like a new car and hadn't required any major work.

OK, like I said in the post title; a warning.

So I tried as many things as possible including removing the rear tail light assembly that has had water intrusion and created similar mass problems for other folks since 2015. Found nothing and drove the truck waiting for the dealer appointment today.

I made a short trip two days ago. Same old, same old. Got back in and started the truck, fan motor blowing everything working! Drove home, shut off. Same old, same old.

Yesterday, started fine, stayed fine. Shut off, started fine, no problems.

Today, off to the dealer's. Started fine, wow, I'm on a roll. Then warning icons and things not working.

Parked in the service lineup at the dealer's. Started going over things but he had to go out and move the truck. Engine starts, warnings flash but it's stuck in gear! Starts truck again, engine dies. Wow, if he didn't believe me before he sure believes me now.

I agreed to a maximum of two hours of diagnostic work. I had told him that I'd already removed the left rear tail light and checked it and the BLIS module for water because that's what the warning display showed. The bottom half is opaque because it houses a module not a light bulb. Others with similar problems have had either a cracked tail light or other water intrusion.

Bottom line: the right tail light had water in it and corrosion on the connectors. Turns out the warning display is generic and displays the left rear as a default symbol. Hard to believe that water in the tail light could do so much damage to the operation of the truck.

So tomorrow I should be getting back my perfectly running truck after they put a new module in the tail light and splice in a new connector. They wanted to supply me with the module and tail light as a unit. Since I know that the module is available by itself I declined. It would only have been $1,400 more for the tail light. Of course they weren't happy and said if there's ever another corrosion problem there it wouldn't be covered by warranty. I told them that just because Ford can't make a water proof module, I can.

So it went from a annoying problem to one that shut down the engine without warning. In some circumstances that could have been a big problem.

I suspect that after 2019 the tail light changed but for owners of 2015-2019 models pay attention if those warnings start appearing and check the tail lights for water intrusion.

Ron

[YakRV]

Originally Posted by jkoenig24

Hmmm. Sounds like FORD is going back to the days of:

Fix
Or
Repair
Daily

and / or

Found
On
Road
Dead

Based on what exactly?

[HABBERDABBER]

A tail light that got some water in it, and stops operation of the vehicle?
Back in my day, sonny, the dang tail light might stop working...but that's all.
Creepy.

[Mike Lewis]

$1,400 for a taillight?! Did I read that right?

[MrLynn]

Originally Posted by HABBERDABBER

A tail light that got some water in it, and stops operation of the vehicle?
Back in my day, sonny, the dang tail light might stop working...but that's all.
Creepy.

Yeah, and what is this 'module' that someone stuck in a tail light? Talk about engineering for failure!

[MrLynn]

Originally Posted by Mike Lewis

$1,400 for a taillight?! Did I read that right?

Including the 'module'?

[Ron in BC]

Yup, hard to believe that some water in a module in the tail light could cause so much grief and expense.

The BLIS sensor, about 4" x 4" square is inside the bottom of the tail light. It is the blind spot and cross traffic sensor.

It comes as a unit installed in a tail light assembly. But it also comes as a freestanding part. Yes, the red plastic part of the tail light without the BLIS module is $1400. On the F150 forum I'll see figures of about $800 US. Additionally, you can't just go to an autowrecker, buy one, and stick it in. It has to be programmed to your VIN.

Now I'm kicking myself that I didn't take the R.S. tail light off. I might have been able to dry and clean it. I'll do a post mortum when I get the part back. My brother-in law can very likely repair the circuit board. I've seen him work miracles with even burn damaged ones.

Ron

[MrLynn]

Originally Posted by Ron in BC

Yup, hard to believe that some water in a module in the tail light could cause so much grief and expense.

The BLIS sensor, about 4" x 4" square is inside the bottom of the tail light. It is the blind spot and cross traffic sensor.

Well, fortunately my 2013 Expedition has no such sensors, so presumably no electronics in the tail lights.

Do we really want cars with minds of their own?

[WillyB]

Originally Posted by jkoenig24

Hmmm. Sounds like FORD is going back to the days of:

Fix
Or
Repair
Daily

and / or

Found
On
Road
Dead

It's actually an old "&^%&": Over Rebuilt Dodge that I Found On the Road Dead so I Fixed Or Repaired it Daily. Now It's First On Race Day.

My hardcore Ford street racer buddy always said that back in the day with his beat up old rusted 750 HP sleeper Mustang. Many years later he now has a 1200+ HP LS twin turbo '67 Nova track car. When he told much how much he spent on the heads alone I almost fell down.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by Ron in BC

... I suspect that after 2019 the tail light changed but for owners of 2015-2019 models pay attention if those warnings start appearing and check the tail lights for water intrusion.

Ron

Just FYI for owners of Gen 14 (2021-2023) F150's with BLIS, the rear cross-traffic modules are still in the rear taillights (other modules for the system are elsewhere, there are a total of 18 components throughout the vehicle listed in the workshop manual related to this BLIS system).

Yeah, we enter a complicated world when we want to enjoy these bits of new technology, and yeah it's unfortunate that they are not failure-proof. It is what it is.

Maybe I'm wrong and there's little solace in it but I don't think owners of any marque are immune to this sort of thing. Some owners are lucky and seem to never have a problem, others get 'hit' with similar issues as evidenced by traffic on forums for all marques.

Sorry, Ron, that you suffered this inconvenience and cost, but glad that the resolution seems to have come relatively quickly. Hopefully you can get back to enjoying your F150 for many more miles as it seems you have up to this point.

[ericbirk]

As a guy who does industrial automation for a living, I can say the majority of the issues are due to poorly designed and cheaply manufactured parts. You can lump in a lack of redundancy and communication.

Well that and domestic's that's my jab for the day.

I'm hypocritical in some ways as I am not one for the latest flashy gadgets, despite my profession. I don't need the most power, or cooled seats (even though they are pretty nice). All I need is a vehicle that will never let me down.

A couple years back we had a cold spell that was almost -40C for a week. My 2 year old F150 work truck absolutely refused to start, even after being plugged in for 24hrs. Our 10 year old Toyota Highlander started without issue. My 26 year old Land Cruiser, also without an issue. The 26 year old LC is the one that goes deep into the bush, and also the one I trust the most to always get me back out.

End of topic derail.

[Roger C H]

Doesn't Ford stand for Fix Or Repair Daily?

[2Travelers]

Originally Posted by Ron in BC

Yup, hard to believe that some water in a module in the tail light could cause so much grief and expense.

Ron

Ron, I'm glad you found the source and were able to get a quick repair. On the related topic of water intrusion and corrosion in F150 tail lights...

It has happened a few times that when backing my 19 into a tight spot, I've turned a bit too sharply and the tail light got pinched by the trailer box. Until this last time I was able to stop befefore inflicting damage but this time I put a hairline crack in the backup light portion of the lens. It is a very slight crack, no pieces crushed or falling out. This discussion about corrosion and the problems it can cause has me wondering if I should attempt to seal whatever opening there may be. Can anyone advise on an appropriate repair that avoids the cost of an expensive replacement, or even if a repair is necessary? Is there a glue or sealant that would flow into the crack and create that seal? I'd appreciate suggestions.

I have since moved the tow bar on the factory WDH out to the next (and last hole) in hopes that will give me the needed clearance. I was reluctant to slide it out because I did not want to increase the leverage on the hitch, but it is a relatively light trailer and I couldn't find any guidance on which of the two holes to use.

[rbryan4]

Originally Posted by MrLynn

Do we really want cars with minds of their own?

There's good and bad with tech in vehicles. For example, automatic braking, blind spot detection and collision avoidance systems have already saved numerous lives.

[LRL]

Thanks for that suggestion! I just ordered a bunch of bags.

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by ericbirk

I'm hypocritical in some ways as I am not one for the latest flashy gadgets, despite my profession. I don't need the most power, or cooled seats (even though they are pretty nice). All I need is a vehicle that will never let me down.

A couple years back we had a cold spell that was almost -40C for a week. My 2 year old F150 work truck absolutely refused to start, even after being plugged in for 24hrs. Our 10 year old Toyota Highlander started without issue. My 26 year old Land Cruiser, also without an issue. The 26 year old LC is the one that goes deep into the bush, and also the one I trust the most to always get me back out.

End of topic derail.

Not about a derail at all. Reliability is the name of the game. When you're in places like this, in the center of Baja, the last thing you want to find out is that your vehicle is stuck in gear or won't start etc.

I've always bought the bottom level truck. Even had to put up with salesmen trying to upsell me making comments like "so you just want a work truck." Which I interpret as "I don't make any money from people like you who only want a base truck." But my wife loved the memory seats because they make switching drivers on long hauls so much easier....... Can't get memory seats unless.....

Ron

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by 2Travelers

Ron, I'm glad you found the source and were able to get a quick repair. On the related topic of water intrusion and corrosion in F150 tail lights...

It has happened a few times that when backing my 19 into a tight spot, I've turned a bit too sharply and the tail light got pinched by the trailer box. Until this last time I was able to stop befefore inflicting damage but this time I put a hairline crack in the backup light portion of the lens. It is a very slight crack, no pieces crushed or falling out. This discussion about corrosion and the problems it can cause has me wondering if I should attempt to seal whatever opening there may be. Can anyone advise on an appropriate repair that avoids the cost of an expensive replacement, or even if a repair is necessary? Is there a glue or sealant that would flow into the crack and create that seal? I'd appreciate suggestions.

You absolutely want to put some sort of plastic glue over the crack area. The first thing that the customer service guy said was that it was probably a cracked tail light. He seemed surprised when I said the tail lights were undamaged.

I'm not sure how waterproof that backup light area is from the sensor area so definitely seal the crack. Most of these types of situations on the F150 forum started with a cracked tail light.

Ron

[Rockhead]

Originally Posted by rbryan4

There's good and bad with tech in vehicles. For example, automatic braking, blind spot detection and collision avoidance systems have already saved numerous lives.

Agree. The system on our outback has saved us numerous times when idots have pulled without looking or stopping . Or the times when one has slammed on their brakes for no reason other then an attempt on a insurance claim