What is that vinyl stuff on the walls? .......

[float5]

Olivers are much taller so require two steps. I wouldn't even want to try to clean the roof much less get on it.

[Patandlinda]

Originally Posted by float5

Olivers are much taller so require two steps. I wouldn't even want to try to clean the roof much less get on it.

Cathy they come with a 2 step already . Just got to see one recently and it was impressive . Pat

[float5]

I know they come with a two step. That is what I mean. The trailer is too tall for me. Our Escapes are just right for the ladder we use for the roof.

[gbaglo]

If, and I repeat if, the vinyl liner sagged, how would condensation get through it to get behind it?
I thought the issue being discussed was water from a leak getting trapped behind the vinyl and I repeat, I've not seen a post on the topic in the eight years I've been on the forum.

[Donna D.]

Oliver uses Prodex insulation between the hulls. Not just blank airspace where water can run through to the bottom and out.

[Patandlinda]

Originally Posted by float5

I know they come with a two step. That is what I mean. The trailer is too tall for me. Our Escapes are just right for the ladder we use for the roof.

I got to check out #2 . It only had 1 step . Now they do have 2 steps . Pat

[Patandlinda]

Originally Posted by float5

I know they come with a two step. That is what I mean. The trailer is too tall for me. Our Escapes are just right for the ladder we use for the roof.

Pat

[LarryandLiz]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

I've been on this forum since inception, almost eight years ago, and I do not recall any post about water getting between the hull and liner or causing mold.

Our 2014 17b, picked up in September 2014, has the two optional upper tail lights. Last summer in July 2015 we were in Oregon during a heat wave when temperatures reached over 39.5 degrees Celsius / 103 degrees Fahrenheit parked on cement. We believe that during that trip the excessive heat caused the upper tail light lenses to expand and separate from the trailer body.

The ETI owners manual states that it is the Owner's responsibility to monitor all lights and other access points on the trailer to ensure that sealant around those entry points remain in place/viable. We did not follow this direction.

This February/March during our wet rainy season I noted water stains showing that water had run down the back corner over the bed. The foam backing of the vinyl and the mattress were wet to the touch. Water had also soaked into the plywood bed platform. Electrical wiring behind the vinyl became a conduit allowing the water to run into the trailer through the driver side upper tail lights. There was mold behind the vinyl corner piece and along the edges of the mattress.

We took the trailer to ETI where it was in their care for one week. The trailer interior was dried via dehumidfiers, the upper tail lights were resealed, the wire holes to the tail lights were sealed, areas where water had entered the trailer were cleaned (a product to remove mold was used) the plywood bed platform was replaced and the mattress was cleaned using the same mold removal product. The corner vinyl was replaced. This work was done under warranty. We did not want to accept the mattress as is and ETI replaced the mattress with us paying 50% as this was a grey area.

As owners we accept that it is our responsibility, as the warranty states, to ensure that sealant around entry points remain viable. We are pleased with the way ETI handled this issue.

Primary Takeaways - keep a keen eye on all entry point sealants - especially the upper tail lights during heat waves.

Larry

[Sandra L]

Wonderful customer service!!!

[padlin]

A number of us have had the gap develop between the trailer body and those rear upper marker lights. A good thing for everyone with them to put down for yearly maintenance checks.

[Bobbito]

Wow! What a story, Larry, and such a great response from ETI.

So, I'm wondering how many actual cases of water damage there have been. Even if there were only one or two, I guess for those paranoid about leaks (like me- based on losing my stick-built to water damage), it will be imperative that the caulking be inspected and maintained regularly. For me that will include checking all the caulking before putting the trailer into storage for the winter. And visual inspection is NOT enough. I will repeat what I was told by the RV repair shop, that you need to pull back on every inch of caulking to see if it releases from the edge it protects. That might be a bit difficult on the wider roof of the 21, reaching under the air conditioner, Maxifan, etc. while on a tall step ladder.

I'm surprised to hear that there was this amount of damage in a relatively new trailer and in such a short period of time. I guess I believed the molded FG trailers wouldn't sustain much damage because the moisture from a leak wouldn't be so hidden away behind a wall and the only wood to rot was in the floor. I forgot about the framing for bed, cupboards, etc. At least the integrity of the wall isn't compromised by a leak. I'm wondering how much stripping away damaged insulation and replacing with new stuff might cost. I plan on never finding out for myself through regular inspections.

Bob K

[freespirit]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

I've been on this forum since inception, almost eight years ago, and I do not recall any post about water getting between the hull and liner or causing mold.

one for the archives ...a helpful story about a leak, mold and how it was handled...all in one.....thanks Larry for the info! it was nice ETI handled it in warranty as it sounds like out of warranty it could have been quite an expensive repair.

the remedy of this event does point out the plus side of a fiberglass interior like the Casita although the Casita carpeted walls and foam would probably suffer a similar fate from mold. And of course the downside being Casita has many more potential points of entry with all the thru hull fasteners. Best to minimize the number of holes/entry points and keep them filled with plenty of elephant snot.

now about that 103 deg F if that was the cause for the taillight leaks...that temp happens on any summer for sustained periods in several southern states....

[freespirit]

after reading Larry's post ..went back to look closer at pic NW Cat posted of the inside of the new 2017 and in particular the one showing the tail light wiring above the window frame....center lights leaking could be a real bummer with exposed wood below wiring and mounting hole entry points.

[Klem]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

If, and I repeat if, the vinyl liner sagged, how would condensation get through it to get behind it?
I thought the issue being discussed was water from a leak getting trapped behind the vinyl and I repeat, I've not seen a post on the topic in the eight years I've been on the forum.

Just because "you" haven't seen a post on this Forum doesn't mean it hasn't happened. Many owners don't use this forum for various reasons including they are uncomfortable with the discreditation posts by folks who should be to 'lubricating' discussions, not causing 'friction'.

Good question. In simplest terms, the ‘sag’ becomes a terrarium growing mold…..

I would guess you have lived in a house with single pane windows. When it got cold outside you saw water, coming out of the air near the window, condense on the window. If you never wiped off the window frame and sill you would see mold forming and it would slowly get to be a moldy mess.

Quote from article: “This describes the situation with molds. They don’t magically appear or re-incarnate when conditions are right. They don’t seep through solid walls as is often assumed. They are always there, floating in the air or carried in moving water, in a dormant state, just looking for the right combination of moisture, heat, and food sources to begin rapid growth.”

When the headliner sags the area behind it fills with air from somewhere or there would be a vacuum and the headliner would never drop to the pull of gravity.

That air is pumped in/out to some degree from changes in barometric pressure 'refreshing' the air. And the thermal stress of heating and cooling in the area slowly expand the “sag”.

When your 1/8" (.125") of fiberglass shell cools below the dew point moisture from that air condenses on the shell. (like the single pane window) some of that water gets into the foam (like the window sill) and mold forms. The mold spores are ‘there’ (see quote above) and multiply rapidly.

After condensing add some heat from the sun beating on the fiberglass and water vapor is formed. It may find its way to the spores or returns to the air. And the cycle continues.

[freespirit]

Klem..your posts are always refreshing...lived in a late 40's built house a long time ago that had bad mold every winter...couldn't take it....just a random thought, leaks are one thing and mold is another as it ain't healthy...maybe getting a less expensive trailer is best so when it does get leaks and mold one can just donate it to the Navy and they can use it to test the catapults on the aircraft carriers...then one can buy another less expensive trailer!

[freespirit]

another random thought from a trailer newbie...would not closed cell foam liner backing or also used as the optional thermal material glued to fiberglass be better as it supposedly does not absorb water like open cell backing on vinyl or carpet liner ...think bigfoot trailers uses closed cell foam on inside of fiberglass and most newer aluminum framed/fiberglass covered trailers...

[J Mac]

Originally Posted by Rosalyn

So I just toured up at ETI and am wondering. What is that vinyl padded stuff on the walls?
Is it durable?
Rosalyn

You bet it's durable, it can handle a scoop of thrown poutine from 20 feet (and be wiped down good as new in a mater of minutes).

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by freespirit

...think bigfoot trailers uses closed cell foam on inside of fiberglass and most newer aluminum framed/fiberglass covered trailers...

Those are examples of rigid foam board, which should be something like extruded polystyrene (XPS, such as Styrofoam™ or Foamular®) but is usually just expanded polystyrene (beadboard). Foam backed flexible lining is another thing entirely. The Bigfoot 2500 series shape is so boxy so that they can use rigid foam and plywood to build the interior.

If a Bigfoot does leak, it is a real problem due to large amount of plywood used in the interior - not just floor and cabinets, but roof structure. Essentially everywhere that beadboard foam appears, there is a sheet of plywood against it.

As far as I know, none of the rest of the current moulded fiberglass travel trailers use a rigid insulation board, except possibly as core material in the cored composite cases (Lil Snoozy, Oliver, and Nest if Airstream ever builds it).

[Bobbito]

I get so much more info than I give on this forum. Thank you for that information Brian.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[LarryandLiz]

Originally Posted by freespirit

one for the archives ...a helpful story about a leak, mold and how it was handled...all in one.....thanks Larry for the info! it was nice ETI handled it in warranty as it sounds like out of warranty it could have been quite an expensive repair.

the remedy of this event does point out the plus side of a fiberglass interior like the Casita although the Casita carpeted walls and foam would probably suffer a similar fate from mold. And of course the downside being Casita has many more potential points of entry with all the thru hull fasteners. Best to minimize the number of holes/entry points and keep them filled with plenty of elephant snot.

now about that 103 deg F if that was the cause for the taillight leaks...that temp happens on any summer for sustained periods in several southern states....

We have a 2014 which has 2 foot long upper tail light strips which can separate from the trailer body in high heat. Hence the need to ensure that they are well sealed. Check with ETI but the new models have a different upper tail light design. I think they have gone to five smaller lights which I think would not tend to separate from the trailer body.

Any product we buy must be maintained. Especially those of us who are new to trailering. We remain quite happy with our "Cute Little 17b" and with ETI.

Larry