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Old 04-15-2016, 06:45 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
One could even put a socket on each side of the trailer, to be able to use the switches at whichever side is more convenient... just in case one is raising the front to level and needs to watch clearance one side at the back.
I just realized that Barry put his socket in the front (propane) compartment, not in the jack switch compartment at one side, so with a moderate length of cable he can already stand on either side using that one socket.
Nicely done, Barry.
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Old 04-15-2016, 07:02 PM   #22
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I don't get the 4-way switch reference though, as all they are is a line, or traveller, transfer switch. Do my lights on these circuits come on backwards when the 4-way is switched?
Each switch in the lineup of a traveler setup switches the power to one of the two traveler wires. The three-ways at each end are simple, but the 4-ways in the middle have this "crossover" wiring: both traveler wires are always connected through the switch, but the switch position determines whether the two trade places (crossover). The light only comes on when there is a complete path from one end to the other; if you did this with train tracks the only two choices would be to crash into a closed switch at the end, or to make it through... and changing the position of any of the switches would change whether you crash at the end (light off) or make it (light on).

This is only switching the hot side, so even if you wired a DC light this way (and you could) it wouldn't be reversed because the negative side of the light would always be connected to ground, and the positive side would always be connected to the switch train.


Of course the other explanation is that when the switches are the wrong way, the light does come on backwards, but you think it's off because you can't see anti-light
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Old 04-15-2016, 07:53 PM   #23
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The switch has to have both negative and positive on it. I attached a pick of the switch. The top two terminals are positive and negative, the middle two are the motor. The bottom two are crossed over from the positive and negative. It is a single winding motor so reversing politarty reverses direction. I used an available(Northern Tool) 7 pin cable and mating recepticle. This cable has 2 #10, 1 #12, and 4 #14. I used the #10 pair for the DC supply to switch box, and then the #14 wires for the rest of the circuit(2 for each motor). Since you do not run the motors very long the 14 ga wire will handle the 28 A just fine. The motors operate well. The only real snag is the switches in the box are very snug because of the stright insulated crimp on connectors i had available. The cover is a 2 gang blank thermoplastic plate which is flexible so the wiring causes the switches to not be flat. If you look close you can see it in my origional post. I plan to aquire 90 degree female crimp connectors which will allow me a little more clearance. If that does not work I will put the switches in a metal cover. The cord is 4' and allows me to stand to either side and not be under the 5 th wheel area, which could be dangerious if the gear would fail.
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Old 04-15-2016, 09:00 PM   #24
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If anyone wants to be able to use much lighter cable and connector, they could use reversing relays mounted in place of the stock switches, and a much lighter-gauge cable to a more compact set of switches carrying only control power for the relays.
I had contemplated this idea too, as it is done with a lot of much heavier equipment than the landing gear motors. Something to consider.
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Old 04-15-2016, 09:02 PM   #25
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The switch has to have both negative and positive on it. I attached a pick of the switch. The top two terminals are positive and negative, the middle two are the motor. The bottom two are crossed over from the positive and negative. It is a single winding motor so reversing politarty reverses direction. I used an available(Northern Tool) 7 pin cable and mating recepticle. This cable has 2 #10, 1 #12, and 4 #14. I used the #10 pair for the DC supply to switch box, and then the #14 wires for the rest of the circuit(2 for each motor). Since you do not run the motors very long the 14 ga wire will handle the 28 A just fine. The motors operate well. The only real snag is the switches in the box are very snug because of the stright insulated crimp on connectors i had available. The cover is a 2 gang blank thermoplastic plate which is flexible so the wiring causes the switches to not be flat. If you look close you can see it in my origional post. I plan to aquire 90 degree female crimp connectors which will allow me a little more clearance. If that does not work I will put the switches in a metal cover. The cord is 4' and allows me to stand to either side and not be under the 5 th wheel area, which could be dangerious if the gear would fail.
Thanks for explaining what you did. Things are much clearer to me now.
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Old 04-15-2016, 09:16 PM   #26
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I carry a small mirror to see the other side, easy peasy!
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Old 04-15-2016, 09:20 PM   #27
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I carry a small mirror to see the other side, easy peasy!
I'm with you Vicki! While this is a neato mod, my mirror works just fine. And I keep it in the hatch with the landing gear switches.
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Old 04-15-2016, 09:28 PM   #28
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You two ladies is just plain boring. We all need to make Tim Taylor proud, and soup things up a bit.

Okay, no we don't, but it sure is fun scheming and planning.
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Old 04-16-2016, 12:56 AM   #29
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Thanks for the details, Barry.
You even covered the crossover jumpers, the common + and - supply, and the use of the different conductors in the 7-conductor cable (with the common circuits potentially carrying double current on the thicker conductors).
So, no surprises.
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Old 04-16-2016, 05:55 AM   #30
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You two ladies is just plain boring. We all need to make Tim Taylor proud, and soup things up a bit.

Okay, no we don't, but it sure is fun scheming and planning.
It IS a neat mod. With my rememberer slowly going away with age . I'd probably end up leaving the switch and connector at home. Wined, wined, wined... crank, crank, crank. Or do the switches inside the hatch still operate?
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Old 04-16-2016, 06:30 AM   #31
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It was tuff working through the small access holes in the LP caompartment, so I removed the upper cabnet's side walls. I also slid the wiring for the curb side so the junction at the motor was easier to reach when working through the access ports. I also replaced the crimp on disconnects with wire nuts.

Atwood has an available remote control which is wireless. I looked it over really close until I was able to price it. $500.00 ouch. It used reversing switches and controled both motors independantly. Independant motor operation is what makes the system flexible, you can level front to back and side to side. Being careful not to put more weight on one jack. The frame is strong enough to let one jack pick the trailer and the other jack.
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Old 04-16-2016, 01:48 PM   #32
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With my rememberer slowly going away with age . I'd probably end up leaving the switch and connector at home
An interesting point, and one that comes up each time that the detachable power cord option is mentioned. On the other hand, and unlike the power cord, these switches are needed to hook up, so one would likely just tuck the box and cable away in the trailer (or truck) after hooking up. Why would one unplug this from the trailer, go the garage or whatever, and put it anywhere but in the trailer or truck? A risk, but doesn't seem like a big one.

This does bring up another question for me: couldn't one make the same setup, but skip the connector and instead just hardwire the cable? If the cable comes out of the outside wall of the trailer a connector is needed, but if coming out of an interior wall of a compartment like Barry's, it could be just rolled up and stowed in that compartment while staying permanently attached.
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Old 04-16-2016, 02:14 PM   #33
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Or do the switches inside the hatch still operate?
I believe that Barry used the stock switches from inside and relocated them to his box on the end of the cable... so no. Those switches are only ten bucks apiece (U.S.), so as I suggested earlier one could leave the fixed switches in and add the remote ones... but don't push both in different directions at the same time!

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Atwood has an available remote control which is wireless. I looked it over really close until I was able to price it. $500.00 ouch. It used reversing switches and controled both motors independantly. Independant motor operation is what makes the system flexible, you can level front to back and side to side. Being careful not to put more weight on one jack. The frame is strong enough to let one jack pick the trailer and the other jack.
Interesting. I assume this is Atwood's 85476, two-jack remote control. The only online listing I found was US$335.92 (but a shipping cost to Edmonton of US$429.42!).

They also have a four-jack system - 80436 (available at Amazon.com). This is a four-jack system, so one could add motors to the C-Jacks on the back and use it to extend those stabilizers as well (not to adjust level).

I don't really want another remote in my life, and don't trust remotes to absolutely always work. Unfortunately, judging from the installation&operation manual for the 4-jack system, there is no provision for hardwired switches (they would risk the problem I mentioned earlier), so if the remote system fails the only backup is hand-cranking, as Donna mentioned.
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Old 04-16-2016, 04:25 PM   #34
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So if you were to retain the stock switch in the same place and add a remote/cable, how would it be wired? Would you connect the cable to the back of the existing switch (existing uses m/f quick-connect) or slice into the wires? or?
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Old 04-16-2016, 05:10 PM   #35
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In case of relay failure, the stock switches could be retained and the relays wired in parallel with them... as long as you never push any of the original switches at the same time that you are using the relays (that has short-circuit possibilities )
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So if you were to retain the stock switch in the same place and add a remote/cable, how would it be wired? Would you connect the cable to the back of the existing switch (existing uses m/f quick-connect) or slice into the wires? or?
I might be inclined to use a terminal block to do the splicing, wiring the circuits in parallel. I would also be tempted to us a DPDT switch for the positive and negative feeds, to switch between the two sets of controls, isolating one set while the other set is energized. This would eliminate any short-circuit possibilities on the rare chance that somehow both getting operated at the same time.
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Old 04-16-2016, 05:18 PM   #36
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If you were wanting to use a smaller box for the controls, you could use these wiring harnesses fro JR Products, along with their motor controls. You would still have to splice them in the box, but they would not stick out as far as your typical spade connector would.

As usual, click on the photos for links.



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Old 04-16-2016, 05:56 PM   #37
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I might be inclined to use a terminal block to do the splicing, wiring the circuits in parallel. I would also be tempted to us a DPDT switch for the positive and negative feeds, to switch between the two sets of controls, isolating one set while the other set is energized. This would eliminate any short-circuit possibilities on the rare chance that somehow both getting operated at the same time.
Good idea - no need to switch all of the outputs, just the power to the switches.
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Old 04-16-2016, 06:38 PM   #38
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I must have freakishly long arms. Until I saw this thread, I never gave it a thought on the difficulty of seeing the landing gear. Peace, Apeman Scott

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Old 04-16-2016, 06:41 PM   #39
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I must have freakishly long arms. Until I saw this thread, I never gave it a thought on the difficulty of seeing the landing gear. Peace, Apeman Scott
Boy, did that comment give me a huge laugh. I have short arms and my son refers to me as "Mom with her T-Rex arms" and then gives a T-Rex squeal.
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Old 04-16-2016, 08:46 PM   #40
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I must have freakishly long arms. Until I saw this thread, I never gave it a thought on the difficulty of seeing the landing gear. Peace, Apeman Scott

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Go sit with those party pooper women, and leave us men folk to build things bigger and better things .

Well, at least do some theoretical thinking.
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