5.0TA Rear Stabilizer Questions

[Centex]

Yet another of my tedious questions I can get answered by ETI but thought I'd give Linda Fedoruk a break and ask the equally friendly and helpful folks here ...

The subject-du-jour is the rear BAL Stabilizer jacks that are standard on late-model 5.0TA. Referring to the attached figure,

• Are the stabilizers two separate units aligned to mount on a frame crossmember, or are they not aligned with a frame crossmember and use the BAL optional channel to link them?
• What's the Out-to-Out 5.0TA frame width where they are mounted?
• What's the jack leg-length (BAL offers many different)?
• Are the stabilizers screwed/bolted to the frame (easily removed) or are they welded (BAL instructions allows either/or)?

Thanks in advance for y'alls answers, as always!

[escape artist]

Originally Posted by Centex

Yet another of my tedious questions I can get answered by ETI but thought I'd give Linda Fedoruk a break and ask the equally friendly and helpful folks here ...

The subject-du-jour is the rear BAL Stabilizer jacks that are standard on late-model 5.0TA. Referring to the attached figure,

• Are the stabilizers two separate units aligned to mount on a frame crossmember, or are they not aligned with a frame crossmember and use the BAL optional channel to link them?
• What's the Out-to-Out 5.0TA frame width where they are mounted?
• What's the jack leg-length (BAL offers many different)?
• Are the stabilizers screwed/bolted to the frame (easily removed) or are they welded (BAL instructions allows either/or)?

Thanks in advance for y'alls answers, as always!

Hi: Centex... A friend ordered a set of bolt on "Sand pads" for his stabilizers. They come in a pkg of 4 so he kindly gave us two. They work great ... no cross members required. One thing you don't want to do is extend them down to far. We put leggo blocks under the sand pads. Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

[Centex]

Originally Posted by escape artist

Hi: Centex... A friend ordered a set of "Sand pads" for his stabilizers. They come in a pkg of 4 so he kindly gave us two. They work great ... no cross members required. One thing you don't want to do is extend them down to far. We put leggo blocks under the sand pads. Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

Thanks, Alf, all that's understood but the 'cross-member' I'm referring to is something affixed to the stabilizers as part of their basic mounting on the trailer frame, not an external device intended to 'improve stability when extended'.

Full disclosure - my Q's go to the feasibility of after-purchase removal of the ETI OE BAL stabilizers and DIY installation of the BAL Powered 'C' Jack. I'm an inherently lazy and decadence-seeking olde phart at this point in life, so this holds some attraction for me .

Yes, I'm aware that BAL also offers the "Power Pak" which can certainly be DIY fitted to the OE jacks and provide similar functionality, but the net cost of that is about the same as the complete Powered 'C' Jack installation and the Power Pak is not nearly as 'elegant a solution' to my eye.

I'm also familiar with the use of a cordless drill for jack 'motivation', that's what I do with my Casita now.

Your recommended use of 'sand pads' and blocks or similar to reduce jack-extension for maximum stability would still apply even with 'powered' stabilizers.

[escape artist]

Originally Posted by Centex

Thanks, Alf, all that's understood but the 'cross-member' I'm referring to is something affixed to the stabilizers as part of their basic mounting on the trailer frame, not an external device intended to 'improve stability when extended'.

Full disclosure - my Q's go to the feasibility of after-purchase removal of the ETI OE BAL stabilizers and DIY installation of the BAL Powered 'C' Jack. I'm an inherently lazy and decadence-seeking olde phart at this point in life, so this holds some attraction for me .

Yes, I'm aware that BAL also offers the "Power Pak" which can certainly be DIY fitted to the OE jacks and provide similar functionality, but the net cost of that is about the same as the complete Powered 'C' Jack installation and the Power Pak is not nearly as 'elegant a solution' to my eye.

I'm also familiar with the use of a cordless drill for jack 'motivation', that's what I do with my Casita now.

Your recommended use of 'sand pads' and blocks or similar to reduce jack-extension for maximum stability would still apply even with 'powered' stabilizers.

Hi: Centrex... I do easy really well!!! My wife winds the stabilizers down... how easy is that!!! IMHO those cross members are for "Mega" 5th's and would be lost on an Escape 5.0TA.
The only thing missing in my pic are the "Rubber boots" and Iowa Dave's got a pair just for me!!! Left right left right? Alf
escape artist N,S, of Lake Erie

[Centex]

Originally Posted by escape artist

I do easy really well!!! My wife winds the stabilizers down... how easy is that!!!

Sounds great, but I'm solo and content to keep it that way, glad to pay for the electric assist!

Originally Posted by escape artist

IMHO those cross members are for "Mega" 5th's and would be lost on an Escape 5.0TA.

The BAL cross-member I'm referring to is required for installation on any size trailer where the stabilizers don't happen to align with a frame cross member for supporting/fastening the inboard end of the jack - I don't know if they do or don't on an Escape 5.0 (?).

[SWCO]

Originally Posted by Centex

Yet another of my tedious questions I can get answered by ETI but thought I'd give Linda Fedoruk a break and ask the equally friendly and helpful folks here ...

The subject-du-jour is the rear BAL Stabilizer jacks that are standard on late-model 5.0TA. Referring to the attached figure,

• Are the stabilizers two separate units aligned to mount on a frame crossmember, or are they not aligned with a frame crossmember and use the BAL optional channel to link them?
• What's the Out-to-Out 5.0TA frame width where they are mounted?
• What's the jack leg-length (BAL offers many different)?
• Are the stabilizers screwed/bolted to the frame (easily removed) or are they welded (BAL instructions allows either/or)?

Thanks in advance for y'alls answers, as always!

Using your diagrams to take measurements, on our 2017 5.0 TA:
-Two separate units aligned on (below) an angle iron frame crossmember
-Out-to-Out 60" (the OD of the 2x3 tubing for the frame running with the
axis of the trailer)
-Jack legs 22"
-Each attached with two self tapping screws into the 2x3 tubing (outboard
ends) and one screw into the angle iron crossmember

[Centex]

Originally Posted by SWCO

Using your diagrams to take measurements, on our 2017 5.0 TA:
-Two separate units aligned on (below) an angle iron frame crossmember
-Out-to-Out 60" (the OD of the 2x3 tubing for the frame running with the
axis of the trailer)
-Jack legs 22"
-Each attached with two self tapping screws into the 2x3 tubing (outboard
ends) and one screw into the angle iron crossmember

Outstanding, Thank You, Good Sir!

[cpaharley2008]

Why not just order an Escape without the rear stabilizers, save yourself some holes....

[arniesea]

Originally Posted by Centex

Thanks, Alf, all that's understood but the 'cross-member' I'm referring to is something affixed to the stabilizers as part of their basic mounting on the trailer frame, not an external device intended to 'improve stability when extended'.

Full disclosure - my Q's go to the feasibility of after-purchase removal of the ETI OE BAL stabilizers and DIY installation of the BAL Powered 'C' Jack. I'm an inherently lazy and decadence-seeking olde phart at this point in life, so this holds some attraction for me .

Yes, I'm aware that BAL also offers the "Power Pak" which can certainly be DIY fitted to the OE jacks and provide similar functionality, but the net cost of that is about the same as the complete Powered 'C' Jack installation and the Power Pak is not nearly as 'elegant a solution' to my eye.

I'm also familiar with the use of a cordless drill for jack 'motivation', that's what I do with my Casita now.

Your recommended use of 'sand pads' and blocks or similar to reduce jack-extension for maximum stability would still apply even with 'powered' stabilizers.

I use a DeWalt 20V drill with a chuck for the stabilizers. I realize you said you wanted the powered unit, and use the drill on your Casita. But from my perspective, it is only 2 jacks and just takes a minute to lower or raise. I have a dedicated drill for the job that lives in the storage area just above the jacks. For me it would not be worth the expense.

That said, if you do end up going that route, I would love to see the pictures!

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Why not just order an Escape without the rear stabilizers, save yourself some holes....

I would say that there would likely be no cost credit, but maybe to avoid the holes it would make sense to delete them anyway.

The new jacks could be mounted to brackets welded to the side of the frame, instead of making structurally inappropriate holes in the frame.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Why not just order an Escape without the rear stabilizers, save yourself some holes....

Only because this mod, if done, would be far from the first priority among mods and I hope to get in some stable camping before that point. I've not asked about this one but IME from discussions about other items ETI's 'deduct' for such deletions is de minimis.

Originally Posted by arniesea

.... from my perspective, it is only 2 jacks and just takes a minute to lower or raise. I have a dedicated drill for the job that lives in the storage area just above the jacks. For me it would not be worth the expense.

Fair enuf!

I'll admit that as a lazy solo camper I'm intrigued by the notion of the potential offered by this little bit of technology in conjunction with Andersen roll-on levelers (for side-to-side) and the power-stabilizer controls located in the compartment with the front Jack switches (for fore-to-aft levelling and stabilizer deployment).

I'll also readily admit that I've got waay too much time on my hands for these 'paper diversions' while waiting for my Build-Sheet due date and eventual August 2021 trailer pick-up at Sumas

As for the expense ..... heck, buying a 5.0 when I've got a perfectly functional Casita is a bit nuts when one gets down to it; but I 'can't take it with me' and a main objective in life for me at this point is "Enjoy it to the max while I can, I've earned it!" (it's taken me many years and much urging from close friends and family to get to that attitude)

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

The new jacks could be mounted to brackets welded to the side of the frame, instead of making structurally inappropriate holes in the frame.

Looking at the 5.0 frame width provided by SWCO and the installation dimensions for the Powered 'C' Jacks (66.5" minimum frame width) that's quite likely to be what's required in any case, at which time the OE holes can be covered/reinforced by the TBD mounting bracket

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Centex

Looking at the 5.0 frame width provided by SWCO and the installation dimensions for the Powered 'C' Jacks (66.5" minimum frame width) that's quite likely to be what's required in any case, at which time the OE holes can be covered/reinforced by the TBD mounting bracket

Good, but the holes have done their structural damage as soon as they're made, and covering them won't help. On the other hand, this isn't a part of the frame where holes in the bottom are a big concern (compared to, for instance, the location of the front jacks on other models).

[Centex]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

... but the holes have done their structural damage as soon as they're made ...

Noting I said "covered/reinforced" IME a carefully considered welded 'scab' can fully mitigate any weakness or stress-riser introduced by those holes without creating another worse situation elsewhere. That's done quite frequently with excellent long-term results in the restoration of much more critical engineered structural members, mobile and otherwise.

FYI per ETI none of their frames employ specially treated alloys, they're excellent candidates for welding. Their main frame tubes are 11ga / 0.120" wall thickness (I've asked).

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Centex

Noting I said "covered/reinforced" IME a carefully considered welded 'scab' can fully mitigate any weakness or stress-riser introduced by those holes without creating another worse situation elsewhere. That's done quite frequently with excellent long-term results in the restoration of much more critical engineered structural members, mobile and otherwise.

Great... with a properly designed bracket serving as a reinforcing plate.

It still seems easier to just do it properly from the beginning, and the frame behind the axles still isn't a critical area for holes in the bottom of the frame anyway.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

... It still seems easier to just do it properly from the beginning ...

It's a compromise to provide immediate functionality for the trailer (again, this 'convenience mod' will definitely be a low-priority among many others).

At this point the mission is just to run the feasibility study far enough to confirm that no Build-Sheet customization is necessary to accommodate the mod. Detail refinements will happen if/when it's executed.

Mission accomplished with the help of everyone's valued info and comments to stimulate the thinking.

Thanks, All!