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Old 03-31-2018, 02:29 PM   #1
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broken frame and sorta peeved!

Went to open our storage box and it was stuck closed! Seems as though our frame is broken! I am guessing 3" frame Escapes basically suck. We did the re-call repair as you can see in the photo. We have 50K miles of 'round the ol' US travel on her, nothing especially rough and never overloaded or out of balance. Now we are stuck in the middle of California heading to Arizona waiting for the welding shop to open on Monday. RRRRRR.

you can see street is right where the bolt is and curb it's right at the jack weld. hummmm.......

steve
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Old 03-31-2018, 02:59 PM   #2
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I would highly recommend contacting Reace at Escape about this.
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Old 03-31-2018, 03:30 PM   #3
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I would highly recommend contacting Reace at Escape about this.
I would second that. It appears that the break point is in a spot right behind the stabilizer mount, near a frame bolt. Weak spot.
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Old 03-31-2018, 03:31 PM   #4
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Hi Steve,
First, I'm so sorry for your troubles. Hope all turns out for the best.

Looking at your pictures: I think I'm looking at cracks on both sides of your frame ... true? The picture of the crack right at the leveler jack tang looks like the welding bead goes over the tang and onto the frame in such a way that it looks like when the jack was installed there was already a misalignment of the lower frame surface but the upper surface seems to be in the same plane. Is that possible? Something is not right here or perhaps I can't see accurately in the picture on my screen.

Tom
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Old 03-31-2018, 03:36 PM   #5
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Only "sorta peeved" ??

That would not be what I'd be saying!
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Old 03-31-2018, 04:02 PM   #6
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So sorry to hear of your problem. Hope you are able to get it fixed quickly and get back on the road again. Have you tried to get a mobile welder to come out and do the repair? Guess it's time for me to crawl under the camper to give the frame a good lookover.
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Old 03-31-2018, 04:54 PM   #7
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Absolutely contact Reace, before having anyone do anything to the frame.

Fortunately, this has happened before and has been resolved. Unfortunately this has happened before (although on only one side):
Fractured chassis 2010 Escape 19' just behind the front jack on driver's side.

When the repair is done, I think there are (at least) three important things to consider:
  1. The bolt hole through the frame is a design problem; it seems very likely that it caused or at least contributed to the failure. I would not accept any solution unless it eliminated this hole - and preferably the other similar holes - replacing them with brackets attached to the side of the frame. The welded attachment of the jacks is also a concern.
  2. The frame is likely made of T1 alloy steel (ASTM A514); as discussed earlier in connection with the other frame failure, this is difficult to weld well, and the welder must be aware of the material and prepared to weld it properly.
  3. The body may need to be separated from the frame for the repair. The only ways to avoid this would be to used extensive plates on each side (so that welding across the top and bottom is not required), or to cut a hole in the floor for access. In the previous case, plates were used.
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Old 03-31-2018, 07:52 PM   #8
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yep, planning on 3/8" plates welded inside and out over the cracks. possibly a bottom plate as well. angle iron brackets and we're G2G!

Interesting thread covering the same issue. Thanks!

steve
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Old 03-31-2018, 08:14 PM   #9
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Is that frame broken on both sides? If it is you could of had a catastrophic failure at hi-way speed . That's crazy . The last thing to worry about shouldn't be a frame failure on a 5 year old trailer .
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Old 03-31-2018, 09:57 PM   #10
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Yes both sides. When it's hitched up the cracks really opens.
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Old 04-01-2018, 12:51 AM   #11
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These frame repairs seem pretty simple, if done before a crack develops, but a little more complicated while traveling. Is this reinforcing something we should just do on our 2012 19’ as a preemptive measure? How many frames have cracked - I’m only aware of three.
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Old 04-01-2018, 01:36 AM   #12
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These frame repairs seem pretty simple, if done before a crack develops, but a little more complicated while traveling. Is this reinforcing something we should just do on our 2012 19’ as a preemptive measure?
I suppose if you assume that the area of the hole for the body-mounting bolt and the weld for the stabilizing jack is a consistent problem, reinforcing plates could be added pre-emptively. I probably wouldn't, because welding problems are probably the cause of the problem, so more field welding might not be prudent.
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Old 04-01-2018, 07:47 AM   #13
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All 19 escapes with the 3" frames became "at risk" after the second battery and storage box were added to the tongue.
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Old 04-01-2018, 08:10 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Jubal View Post
All 19 escapes with the 3" frames became "at risk" after the second battery and storage box were added to the tongue.
Anybody want to tackle quantifying the stress caused by a WDH? This section of the frame is reacting all the preload of the spring bars lifting the rear of the TV.
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Old 04-01-2018, 10:28 AM   #15
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Did Flatpick say his trailer has a weight distribution thing?
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Old 04-01-2018, 12:07 PM   #16
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Anybody want to tackle quantifying the stress caused by a WDH? This section of the frame is reacting all the preload of the spring bars lifting the rear of the TV.
A typical WD installation for a trailer of this size and tongue weight will need to transfer about 100 pounds to the trailer axles (and 150 pounds to the tug's front axle) to restore the tug's front axle load to the unhitched condition... varying substantially based on specific tug dimensions and tongue weight, of course. The axle centre of a 19' is something like 15 feet from the ball, so that's 1500 lb-ft of torque to be applied by the WDH and carried by the frame rails, or 750 lb-ft per bar or chain. A typical two-bar WD has bars working at about a two-foot lever arm or a bit longer, so that's 300 to 400 pounds of vertical load on the WD frame brackets (or tension in each chain).

Using the WD is like having one hefty person standing on each frame rail, midway back on the tongue, while the trailer goes over bumps. Yeah, I think this will aggravate frame problems.

The Andersen No-Way WD is constructed differently, so the forces applied to the frame are different (horizontal rather than vertical), but the torque on the frame is the same to have the same load transfer effect.

(All values in this quick analysis are in imperial units for forum members not familiar with metric units, and are rounded to convenient and approximate values. This is not for for illustration purposes only.)
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Old 04-01-2018, 12:17 PM   #17
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Did Flatpick say his trailer has a weight distribution thing?
From a couple of years ago:
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Full sized Ford E-250 here. Having towed our E-19 with and without the WDH it's a no-brainer that it's a better (and safer) ride with. We do ride with alot of gear in the van.

steve
Steve, you still list the E-250 tug; are you still using a WD system?

In an interesting coincidence - or perhaps a relevant condition - the other owner with a frame crack (RWD) also appears to have been towing with a full-sized Ford van; I can't tell from the discussion whether or not Richard (RWD) was using a weight-distribution system.
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Old 04-01-2018, 12:46 PM   #18
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very interesting....

yes we us a WD system. when we hook up tomorrow to take to the welder, I will see what effect the system has on the cracks as we put the bars into tension.

steve
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Old 04-01-2018, 12:53 PM   #19
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yes we us a WD system.
Thanks

Quote:
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when we hook up tomorrow to take to the welder, I will see what effect the system has on the cracks as we put the bars into tension.
That would be interesting to see, but my suggestion would be to not use the WD until the frame is repaired.
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Old 04-01-2018, 12:55 PM   #20
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That would be interesting to see, but my suggestion would be to not use the WD until the frame is repaired.
Yeah. Last thing you need is a complete break making it untowable before you can get it to the shop. I'd check it with the WDH once you're there.
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