Replacing Waste Valve on 17B With Fully Insulated Bottom

[USMCJS]

I need to replace my waste valve for black water on my 2016 17b that has the fully insulated bottom ( thick spray on insulation painted black). My problem is that my waste valve is broken and leaking. I managed to get the 4 bolts out which did require minor removal of some of the insulation that was covering the nuts. Now I find that because of all the insulation the lines are held so tight that the waste valve will not come out. Normally I believe you can separate the two plumbing parts where the valve goes by gently pulling them apart so you can install the new valve and gaskets. But, all the insulation has everything in a bear hug and there is no flexibility whatsoever to allow removal of the valve. Anyone here have the fully insulated bottom and maybe solved this maintenance issue ? Thank you.

[cpaharley2008]

You may want to consult with the factory on this........

[Merlin]

Originally Posted by USMCJS

I need to replace my waste valve for black water on my 2016 17b that has the fully insulated bottom ( thick spray on insulation painted black). My problem is that my waste valve is broken and leaking. I managed to get the 4 bolts out which did require minor removal of some of the insulation that was covering the nuts. Now I find that because of all the insulation the lines are held so tight that the waste valve will not come out. Normally I believe you can separate the two plumbing parts where the valve goes by gently pulling them apart so you can install the new valve and gaskets. But, all the insulation has everything in a bear hug and there is no flexibility whatsoever to allow removal of the valve. Anyone here have the fully insulated bottom and maybe solved this maintenance issue ? Thank you.

I have the same situation; insulation and almost no flex in the pipe. Here is what I did with a mod but will warn you that it is not going to be a walk in the park. YMMV!

BTW, taking off the old was the "easy" part for me. Putting the replacement on tested my patience... I few choice words were uttered.

Removal:
I used a small flat screw driver to open a ~1/16 (?) gap allow the thinnest of space between the seat flange(?) and gate assembly. Gently slid in a putty knife on both sides. From there the gate practically fell out.

Replacement:
Performed the opposite operation. Trouble was that the seals wanted to fall from their seat and I didn't have any way to hold them in place while putting things back together. Some water proof grease would have done the trick but I didn't have this available. Someone to hold the putty knifes in place while I got the gate back in would have helped but I didn't have this available either. You will have to open the space, while keeping the seals in place, while getting the gate into position.

I had to pull things apart a couple of times before getting lucky with maneuver.

So, it is possible. I recommend that you gently test out the spreading part to see if you actually have any flex available if you go this route.

[KLRchickie]

Removing both the grey and black valves at the same time and then fitting them back in together make the job go pretty easily. We’ve replaced two black valves on our 17B now. After the first dis & reassembly the grey valve slides better than it ever had since new.

[Aptos17]

Originally Posted by KLRchickie

Removing both the grey and black valves at the same time and then fitting them back in together make the job go pretty easily. We’ve replaced two black valves on our 17B now. After the first dis & reassembly the grey valve slides better than it ever had since new.

I have exactly the same problem in trying to remove a cracked black waste valve as UCMCJS, with the plpes held tightly together by insulation. I have removed the graywater valve bolts also, but the valves cannot be pulled out and I am concerned with using putty knives and pry tools as the plastic is brittle.
KLRchickie please give more detail on how you successfully removed and reinstalled both valves.

[MVA]

We removed the foam from the valves to the tanks. That allowed enough flex to remove, and more important, enough flex to install the new valves.

[KLRchickie]

Originally Posted by Aptos17

I have exactly the same problem in trying to remove a cracked black waste valve as UCMCJS, with the plpes held tightly together by insulation. I have removed the graywater valve bolts also, but the valves cannot be pulled out and I am concerned with using putty knives and pry tools as the plastic is brittle.
KLRchickie please give more detail on how you successfully removed and reinstalled both valves.

It’s possible that your 2022 is different from our 2014, I really don’t know.

We replaced another black valve last fall…
Undo all the bolts from both valves. Wiggle it all apart. Grease seals so that they stay where you need and fit it all back together. Lots of maneuvering and cursing involved . Hope that you don’t have a seal move & get pinched resulting in having to start over…

[Aptos17]

Success! Thanks to all who offered suggestions.
A friend and I used a knife and putty knife to remove insulating foam from the gray-water pipe all the way back to the tank, and on the black-water side a few inches to allow for access and removal of gate valve bolts. As my friend pulled back the gray-water pipe, I dislodged the valve units and effluent pipe. Then I cleaned connecting surfaces and installed clean, greased seals to the fixed pipe ends and effluent pipe piece, seals concave side onto pipes, using plumber's silicon grease that doesn't soften rubber. I installed the new black-water valve, then bolts nut side toward the effluent piece, and tested it by adding water to the toilet. Then, with the seals temporarily grease-glued to the pipes, my friend pulled back on the gray-water pipe to allow a larger gap so that I could insert the gray-water gate valve being careful not to fold back and dislodge the seals. Adjusted angle of valves and effluent pipe, inserted bolts and tightened, then tested gray-water valve by filling sink. Total job time five hours. Next time one or two hours.
I'll suggest to Escape Industries that they use wrap insulation for the pipes instead of rigid foam.

[Bill_75]

Thanks for all the forewarning on the hassles involved in replacing the dump valve. Due to some road debris, ours also needed to be replaced.

A couple of things I thought I'd share to help the others that attempt this repair.

1.On our 2016 21, the valve/pipe sizes are not the same. The black water is a 3", while the gray water is 1.5".

2.Separating the insulated pipes to replace the valve was by far the biggest problem, as other folks have noted earlier. Since I was solo on the repair, and without 3 hands to pull pipes, hold valves in, and push in the replacement, I used a :

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Hyper-Tou...0&from=/search

ratchet tie down, threaded through the tire rim, over the grey water valve/pipe to gingerly pull the pipes 1/4" or so apart while the valve was replaced. After spending 45 minutes of frustration/cursing, it really made it much easier.

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by Bill_75

After spending 45 minutes of frustration/cursing, it really made it much easier.

Yes, I find that a little cursing relieves some frustration. Oh, you meant the rachet strap.

Good job and a novel solution.


Ron

[Bill_75]

Thanks !

[MVA]

I realize it is too late for Bill_75 since he was dealing with this last summer, but for others....

If you cut the gray exit line halfway between the tank and the gray tank dump valve, and then rejoin with a Fernco connector, it can help in two ways.

One, it makes reconnecting the dump valves much easier, allowing some slack in the connection. Also, it reduces stress in the dump valve connections, perhaps mitigating gray tank exit flange breakage.

Second, it allows to be able to flush the gray tank and clean gray tank sensors.

YMMV