Water pump problems

[steve dunham]

The small RV store in our home town carries Shurflo inline check valves that work with numerous styles of Shurflo pumps .
Cost was around $10 for the part plus you need a couple hose clamps .

[C&G in FL]

Originally Posted by Rutterslo

From the photos they sent, it looked as if I had to undo and clamp each of the water lines, unbolt the pump and then install the check valve (which I assume was either never installed on the pump they sent me or wore out in 14 months of very infrequent use). Given the location of the pump, I wouldn't rate this as an easy or comfortable job. Certainly not one I'm going to undertake a thousand miles from home and mechanics I trust. But what do I know.

I apologize if I seem to be a little bit critical, but this is more intended as "tough love" rather than criticism. In your original post you criticized ETI for assuming you are a "talented" mechanic. Well, you are not going to be even a less than competent mechanic if you are afraid to even attempt to pick up a screwdriver and try. The check valve fix is so simple my wife, who has no mechanical experience, could successfully do it. While you may have to clamp the outflow tube supplying the trailer, you do not have to clamp the line from the fresh water tank as it is lower than the pump. And with smart phones or digital cameras, you can take pictures at every step in the event you get confused when reassembling.

And again, I am not trying to be mean and I fully understand frustration, but anyone who buys an RV and expects all of its mechanical components to function perfectly ad infinitum has unrealistic expectations. And anyone who is unwilling to attempt even simple repairs is going to spend a lot on replacement components and even more on labor charges.......unnecessarily I would add. All it takes is willingness to try. Fixing the water pumps check valve isn't rocket science. You can do it, even if you are 1,000 miles from home.

[elongest]

Thanks for the reply on the external check valves. There are lots of good detailed You Tube videos on RV pump repair.
Eddie

[cpaharley2008]

another reason to use a water filter to keep your water clean and free of debris....

[thoer]

Originally Posted by Rutterslo

... And no apologies for causing a second major headache in 14 months....And no apologies for two major problems in the water in two years.

If you've read this far I'm aggravated by Escape. Am I alone?

This is a very helpful friendly place with most folks with any knowledge going out of their way to help each other. The vast majority of folks here are way more than satisfied with their Escapes and with the customer service of ETI. Many of us know Reace and Tammy and many of us have experiences with other RV manufacturers for comparison.

Are there folks who are aggravated with Escape, yes. A recurring handful will always be more than willing to jump in and help bash ETI at any possible opportunity.

IMHO your first sentence explains why, to me, that aggravation you and others often aim at ETI is misplaced. Escape did not cause any of the headaches you describe - the manufacturer of the water pump(s) did. Escape tries very hard to solve even those problems, but it needs to be made clear what has been stated here, Escape is not the manufacturer of pumps/appliances.

[Viajante]

The matter of warranty work is a no win situation for the customer and ETI because the isn't a dealer network. Buyers of new vehicles, boats, rvs etc are accustomed to going back to a dealer for parts and labor under warranty. They don't expect to have to deal individually with the manufacturer of each component or be surprised to find out they have to do the installation themselves. It's frustrating. And for ETI it is a pain to provide parts, advice, and maybe contracted tech help at long range.

Buying factory direct is like buying online in that you can't take it back to the local store to be fixed or replaced. Unless you live near Chilliwack.

[escape artist]

Originally Posted by Viajante

The matter of warranty work is a no win situation for the customer and ETI because the isn't a dealer network. Buyers of new vehicles, boats, rvs etc are accustomed to going back to a dealer for parts and labor under warranty. They don't expect to have to deal individually with the manufacturer of each component or be surprised to find out they have to do the installation themselves. It's frustrating. And for ETI it is a pain to provide parts, advice, and maybe contracted tech help at long range.

Buying factory direct is like buying online in that you can't take it back to the local store to be fixed or replaced. Unless you live near Chilliwack.

Hi: Vijante... I'll take buying factory direct over paying a dealer premium price any day!!! Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

[Rutterslo]

I started this thread. I appreciate very much the sharing and suggestions; could do without the scolding.

Concluded:

1. Escape is a first rate company, with a first rate product. They are sending a check valve to my home. Seems fair.
2. It's clear our experience is not unheard of among Escape owners. Maybe a pump with more reliability should be on Reace's agenda.
3. I've traveled 10s of thousands of miles in a Casita and and 7 thousand in an Escape over the last 14 years. I've never had a pump problem before; now two in two years. Something's amiss.
4. I'm an okay mechanic, one who knows that working with water appliances in very cramped spaces a thousand miles from friends and mechanics with known ability invites disaster.

Thanks to most of you.

We'll continue on, using city water where available and watching the level in the fresh water tank.

Time to move on to other topics.

[LarryandLiz]

Originally Posted by Viajante

The matter of warranty work is a no win situation for the customer and ETI because the isn't a dealer network. Buyers of new vehicles, boats, rvs etc are accustomed to going back to a dealer for parts and labor under warranty. They don't expect to have to deal individually with the manufacturer of each component or be surprised to find out they have to do the installation themselves. It's frustrating. And for ETI it is a pain to provide parts, advice, and maybe contracted tech help at long range.

Buying factory direct is like buying online in that you can't take it back to the local store to be fixed or replaced. Unless you live near Chilliwack.

Yes. In my view as someone not mechanically inclined but happily living near Chilliwack, our close proximity to Chilliwack was a major comfort factor when buying our Escape. anyone like me but living far away should be ready to pick up a screwdriver.

That being said, for me at 63 years old and retired, having earned my living through using my head rather than hands, I like the challenge of learning something new. It's a way to stay young. I really do understand the OP's pain specially experiencing issues while on s trip.

Larry S

[gbaglo]

Originally Posted by Viajante

The matter of warranty work is a no win situation for the customer and ETI because the isn't a dealer network. SNIP.
Buying factory direct is like buying online in that you can't take it back to the local store to be fixed or replaced. Unless you live near Chilliwack.

I don't think a dealer network would help all that much, if at all. There would be too few dealers so you'd still have to drive across two states to get to one.
But, the appliance manufacturers do currently have service centres all over North America, because they sell to all RV builders.

[Greg A]

Just a curious question. Seems to me we're hearing pump failure on 19's more than other models, could be wrong on that just my impression from reading over the years. The 19 pump is mounted vertically and in none of the other trailers I've had were the pumps mounted vertically they were always horizontal on the floor.
So my question is how are the pumps mounted in each of the Escape models, vertical or horizontal?
Second part of the question would be, who has had pump replacements in late model trailers by model?

[ReagentGrade]

Originally Posted by Viajante

Buyers of new vehicles, boats, rvs etc are accustomed to going back to a dealer for parts and labor under warranty. They don't expect to have to deal individually with the manufacturer of each component or be surprised to find out they have to do the installation themselves. It's frustrating.

It's certainly a pain for everyone. I don't believe it's fair to say that ETI always expects to to fix it yourself. I've heard of many instances where ETI paid for a local servicer to do a repair.
In this particular case, the repair is easy enough that it would be more convenient for the owner to do it themselves.
Given a choice between doing it myself in less than an hour vs. hooking up, finding a repair place, taking in my trailer, getting in line, waiting several hours (or more), etc. Plus, if I do it myself I'm fairly confident it was done correctly.

[bdornbush]

Like others, I have a 19 where the pump failed, in my case twice. The pump was mounted vertically. The first pump was a Shurflo and the check valve stuck so no water would flow even though the pump was running. We were in a national park and I called ETI. Reace spoke with me and texted photos of how to free up the check valve and sent a replacement pump. As others have said, it is awkward to work on the pump, and I didn't want to end up with a nonfunctioning water system so I waited until I got home to replace it. Fortunately, we were mostly staying in places with city water hookup. The replacement pump was an Artis pump which Reace said they were now using as they had such bad luck with the Shurflo. It also failed, it would not pump a volume of water but the pump motor was working. I again contacted ETI and they told me that Artis wanted me to work with them directly. I contacted Artis and they told me how to adjust the pump. It didn't work even though adjusted as recommended. So they sent a replacement pump under their 2 year warranty. That replacement has worked so far. The instructions for it said to mount either vertically or horizontally, but if mounted vertically, mount pump head down. I originally learned this from this forum. I had mounted it pump head up so I could hopefully adjust it if needed and I didn't want to give that up, so I remounted it horizontally.

I can only say positive things about both ETI and Artis as they stood behind their products and got me working again at "only" the cost of the aggravation of not having a working pump while on the road and the work of replacing. But now that I have done it several times, I am ready to do it again if needed. I carry the old Shurflo as a backup if needed. I know how to free up the check valve, thanks to Reace's photos.

[C&G in FL]

Originally Posted by Greg A

Just a curious question. Seems to me we're hearing pump failure on 19's more than other models, could be wrong on that just my impression from reading over the years. The 19 pump is mounted vertically and in none of the other trailers I've had were the pumps mounted vertically they were always horizontal on the floor.
So my question is how are the pumps mounted in each of the Escape models, vertical or horizontal?
Second part of the question would be, who has had pump replacements in late model trailers by model?

In my 5.0TA, it was mounted horizontally on the floor. It still is, although I constructed an anti-vibration mount and installed it between the pump and the floor. When doing so, I cut the wires to the pump and installed a connector on both sides, similar to those found on trickle chargers. As a result, if and when I ever have to replace the check valve it will be as easy as removing two screws which hold the pump down, disconnecting the inflow and outflow tubes, and unplugging the electrical connection. That way the check valve replacement can be done at the table rather than trying to do it in place.
Incidentally, I have used the procedure posted by Alf twice when the ShurFlo's check valve malfunctioned, allowing the fresh water tank to fill and overflow when connected to city water. Once with one of my Aliners and one with the 5.0TA. It worked both times to "unstick" the check valve. It is worth trying before pulling the pump apart.

[rubicon327]

I think this thread older thread may help tie some of this together:
http://www.escapeforum.org/forums/f3...ater-7885.html

Escape owners are not the first to have issues with Shurflo pumps. I'm wondering if anyone out there has experience with either Flojet, Jabsco, etc. There are many pumps that have been made for the marine industry that may serve the discerning RVer well.

www.westmarine.com/freshwater-pumps

[azjack]

Greg, I can't remember if I had a pump problem in the 19, but the 21 did while on a trip and as I tried to adjust the pump I decided the location it was mounted was too hard to reach. It was mounted vertically under the bench just aft of the fridge. Since we were on the road I stopped at an RV store and bought another pump that I mounted under the fridge horizontally with a loop in the hose and additional rubber padding under the mounting feet. I saved my telephone time and the pump has worked for the last year or two and is quieter. I lost about 50 inches of storage space in the cabinet below the fridge but we have a lot of extra space.
Jack
P.S. Greg, do you have the recluse spiders where you park your trailers? I got hit again with one.

[Iowa Dave]

Hi Jack
Just dewinterized the last couple days. Water pump fired right up and working well. It's vertically mounted and other than the three way valve I put in to suck the antifreeze out of the jug, it's just like we got
It. Put new brakes on, they were not too bad but it was time. Figure it's somewhere around 50,000 miles. Drums were fine. See you in Osoyoos. Dos Equiis on me.
Dave

[Greg A]

Originally Posted by azjack

Greg, I can't remember if I had a pump problem in the 19, but the 21 did while on a trip and as I tried to adjust the pump I decided the location it was mounted was too hard to reach. It was mounted vertically under the bench just aft of the fridge. Since we were on the road I stopped at an RV store and bought another pump that I mounted under the fridge horizontally with a loop in the hose and additional rubber padding under the mounting feet. I saved my telephone time and the pump has worked for the last year or two and is quieter. I lost about 50 inches of storage space in the cabinet below the fridge but we have a lot of extra space.
Jack
P.S. Greg, do you have the recluse spiders where you park your trailers? I got hit again with one.

Hey Jack,
I got bit we think by a brown recluse when we first moved up here, so they're around. Hard to spot though, so haven't seen one in the trailer yet.

Did you get a bite?

[Greg A]

So we're at:
19 vertical
21 vertical
5.0 horizontal
I'm pretty sure my 05 17B was horizontal
GBag-09 17B Vertical

19's and 21 are reported failure so far

[gbaglo]

17' Vertical. And no problems in eight years. ( Had to clean out faucet aerator ) But, we don't have hard water here.