New Tow For The Escape 5.0 (Experienced Advice Needed)

[MrLynn]

We have an older (2013) Expedition, the Max version with the full tow package, and a 5.4L V8: mileage is poor, but good power. Towing the 21C is fairly effortless.

Only problem was opening the liftgate, which hits the power jack on the tongue; we have the Fastway E2 WDH. Solution was to get a 14" ball mount, which allows plenty of clearance.

 

[DanandDaphne]

Having had a couple trucks as tow vehicles, and having had the fiberglass shells on both trucks leak and get our gear wet in downpours, we have opted for a full sized RV. Just before that 9900 mile Mexico trip, we got a recent year Ford Expedition 4x4, which is a F150 based SUV, with the Ecoboost 3.5L and 10 speed transmission, as a 2019, it has some engineering improvements over the first gen ecoboost and stuff. Its not perfect, but damn, it was comfortable for that 9900 mile 4 month road trip. Towed the 4500 lb E21 like a dream over all sorts of rough roads. After getting home from that trip, I did get an Andersen WDH hitch because we did feel a little tendency to sway and pitch once in awhile, and the Anderson on our first trip after getting it completely eliminated any of that.

The Expedition 4x4 (not Max) turns in a 42 foot circle, I have to be a little careful not to clip a taillight doing a really tight circle. My tow vehicle for this E21 for most of the years we've owned it was a 2002 F250 4x4 diesel 8' long bed monster truck, that thing had a 62 foot circle, which made tight maneuvers really difficult.

If you prefer chevy, a late model Tahoe would be the equivalent of the Expedition (not Max). or if you prefer the long wheel base, then its a Suburban vs a Expedition Max.. I wanted to be able to parallel park in a normal sized parking space so I got the short version, its still a 3 row SUV with 8 adult seats, its just shy on cargo space if the 3rd row is deployed.

Since there's just two of us, heh, cargo space?

Couldn't agree any more, I don't care for a topper on a pick up. It defeats most of the usefulness of a pick up and it just turns it into a sort of SUV but not as good. Most people once that heavy fiberglass topper goes on their truck it never comes off the entire time they own it.

They would be better served with a Suburban or Tahoe or Ford Expedition. You can still haul just as much stuff (probably more) but you can also comfortably haul additional passengers.

And if you need a truck for dirty work, hauling firewood, dirt or compost and that sort of thing then a pickup without a topper is usually better.

We have a 4wd 93 Toyota pickup short bed standard cab and we have a toper on that. It's our Jeep for getting into the back country on all the mountain passes here in Colorado. I would prefer a first generation 4runner over it but this came our way and is in great shape with only 85K on the odometer. The cab is so small it's nice to have a topper on it and we don't use it for much of anything else.

 

[brroberts]

There are many reasons to choose a 5.0 or travel trailer. We chose travel trailer. We prefer them, but there are pros and cons to both. We have two trucks. I’m considering a third. We still chose travel trailer. My parents only had one truck and chose 5.0. Get what fits your needs best.

 

[John in Santa Cruz]

I had a topper on both my pickup trucks, they were being used to carry astronomy gear as well as camping gear. No SUV has the cargo volume of a 8' longbed F250 :

 

[Centex]

....
We understand that the 3220 currently manufactured is Generation 3 and has a smaller footprint (welcomed) but also a different setback, putting the ball either closer to the cab or closer to the tailgate by 2plus inches than the previous Generation 2 version. We also understand the Generation 3 Hitch is slightly taller as well. ....

Mark - this perhaps of interest / FYI ....
(Andersen installation instructions for both Gen 2 and Gen 3 stipulate that the Andersen Ultimate Gooseneck Base should be installed with the Andersen ball to the rear of the gooseneck ball, therefore no 'reversed base' configuration is shown)

 

[Drumstick63]

Alan, am I correct in assuming that the new Gen 3 Andersen Ultimate Hitch will offer less cab clearance from the leading edge of the 5.0TA in turns making for a greater possibility of contact between the trailer and the cab? Also, would the closer distance between the tailgate and the camper possible cause contact with the rear of the truck during turns? If so, the Gen 3 Andersen doesn't look like good choice for the 5.0TA and 5.5' bed pickups. Please correct me if I am wrong!

I guess I will keep looking for an F150 XLT Supercab, 6.5' bed, White, 3.5 Ecoboost, 4x4, 36 gallon tank, tow/haul package, etc. So far, there is not much available even when searching nationwide.

Thanks again for all you help!

 

[Centex]

Alan, am I correct in assuming that the new Gen 3 Andersen Ultimate Hitch will offer less cab clearance from the leading edge of the 5.0TA in turns ....

I don't know any way to convey the clearances more clearly than the diagram I posted above.

IMO the second configuration shown (GEN 3 ANDERSEN, COUPLER BLOCK TO REAR OF KINGPIN) will not result in trailer>rear of truck conflict but will require more care regarding an 'open tailgate' when hitching/unhitching.

I don't know the 'jackknife' angle that can be achieved with the GEN 2 on a 5.5ft bed - I only have experience with the 6.5ft bed which provides generous cab clearance with the GEN 2 Andersen. So, I don't know if the trailer being ~2" closer to the cab with a GEN 3 will present a meaningful constraint with the 5.5ft bed (again, how often do we 'jackknife' our rigs to extreme angles?).
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One other possibility, IF it will fit under the Andersen GEN 3 Base (I do not know if it will!), is addition of the B&W Turnoverball 4" Extender. See below, this provides more cab and open-tailgate clearance than the GEN 2, while also providing adequate closed-tailgate clearance IMO.
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Personally, I'd look for the truck with the features and overall length you want to be driving mile-after-mile on your travels (for me, a SuperCrew with 6.5ft box is just too long, but YMMV). I strongly suspect that the hitch situation, GEN 2 or GEN 3, can be worked-out and yield miles of happy-camping with whatever bed length.

All the above is about all I can think of to offer at the moment.

 

[Jeremy Kessenich]

Thanks for the graphic Alan.

Question on mounting the coupler block to the front vs rear of the kingpin. Though all the combinations show the pinbox clearing the tailgate, would the pinbox clear the bedrails with the coupler to the front of the kingpin?

Where I'm heading with this is, am I'm correct in thinking that if I wanted more clearance for the tailgate opening it's better to get the 4" extender than turning the coupler around because using the 4" extender wouldn't impact the pinbox and bedrail clearance (coupler to the rear of kingpin with 4" extender) but the turning the coupler block around (coupler to the front without the 4" extender) would impact the bedrail clearance?

Thanks in advance

Jeremy

 

[jnfrombigt]

I don't know how it will work with the shortbed Ford but I have used 4" offsets with both a RAM and A GMC both shortbeds. I have an older Anderson hitch and according to the ESCAPE compatibility chart I can do a 70 degree angle. I picked up the ESCAPE in Chilliwack and transported it to South Carolina with the RAM and no offset ball. I didn't experience any negative issues. The 4" offset ball was later installed. No, you won't have 90 degrees but...

 

[Centex]

....
Question on mounting the coupler block to the front vs rear of the kingpin. Though all the combinations show the pinbox clearing the tailgate, would the pinbox clear the bedrails with the coupler to the front of the kingpin?....

My F150 is 63.5" inside-of-rail-to-inside-of rail. So the rail is 31.75" from the pivot-point.

If you orient the coupler block forward of the kingpin the pivot-point to back-of-pinbox is 36".

So yeah, that's a problem, and should have been noted on the diagrams.

... Where I'm heading with this is, am I'm correct in thinking that if I wanted more clearance for the tailgate opening it's better to get the 4" extender than turning the coupler around because using the 4" extender wouldn't impact the pinbox and bedrail clearance (coupler to the rear of kingpin with 4" extender) but the turning the coupler block around (coupler to the front without the 4" extender) would impact the bedrail clearance?

That makes sense.

 

[Desert Storm Vet]

I can't comment on the Ford part of your question but my Gen 2 Tundra CrewMax has the 5'5" box and it works perfectly fine with my new Anderson rail mount hitch.

I previously had a Reece traditional 5th wheel hitch and while it worked perfectly, it was heavy. My payload is limited in the Tundra and I found the Anderson would save me considerable weight so I switched.

I have no clearance issues with the box length but then I prefer not to jackknife the trailer anyway.

Like someone else mentioned, pay close attention to payload of any truck you consider.

I have a 2025 Tundra and plan to purchase a 5.0 and was wondering what "standard rail mount system" you used with your Anderson hitch. I called Anderson and just like their documents they just reference a "standard rail system". I have been researching these rail mount systems and there are quite a few to choose from.

Thanks ahead of time for your help

 

[iamunique127]

Mine is a Universal rail mount, brand unknown by me. The type is fairly common. It was installed by TradeMasters in Chilliwack for a Reece traditional fifth wheel hitch.

I am just repeating what I've heard here but I believe your new Tundra has a composite box which is incompatible with a rail mount system. From what I understand you will need to have an underbody ball mount installed (that may not be the correct term for it, sorry, I haven't followed that situation too closely.) The good news is the Anderson Ultimate hitch for you will be aluminum and weigh less than the rail mount type of steel hitch.

 

[Jim Bennett]

My F150 SuperCab has the 6.5' box. It is crazy that they describe it as a long box. I have had a pickup for the last 40 years and all have had an 8' bed. There is no way I would want to go shorter than a 6.5' bed. Pickups are for carrying things and pulling trailers for me, and even 6.5' is a bit short at times.

The OP says there are no 6.5' beds available. This makes no sense to me as most of the ones for sale around here have them. If not they should be easy to order.

 

[DanandDaphne]

I have a 2025 Tundra and plan to purchase a 5.0 and was wondering what "standard rail mount system" you used with your Anderson hitch. I called Anderson and just like their documents they just reference a "standard rail system". I have been researching these rail mount systems and there are quite a few to choose from.

Thanks ahead of time for your help

There is no rail mount option available for the new Tundra due to the composite bed your only option is for the B&W turnover ball system.

We have a 24 Tundra and a 5.0 which I converted to a gooseneck with the Reese goose box 1600K https://www.etrailer.com/5th-Wheel-Gooseneck-Adapter/Reese/RP94716-61301.html
I really like this system it's really nice to not have a hitch to install and remove and then store when not using it just takes a second to drop in the ball extension that gives tailgate clearance. Tows just like before I can't say it's better in this regard as our 5.0 has always towed like a dream.

Anderson makes a version of their hitch that connects to a goose ball rather than rails https://www.etrailer.com/5th-Wheel-Gooseneck-Adapter/Andersen/AN67VR.html

 

[DanandDaphne]

My F150 SuperCab has the 6.5' box. It is crazy that they describe it as a long box. I have had a pickup for the last 40 years and all have had an 8' bed. There is no way I would want to go shorter than a 6.5' bed. Pickups are for carrying things and pulling trailers for me, and even 6.5' is a bit short at times.

The OP says there are no 6.5' beds available. This makes no sense to me as most of the ones for sale around here have them. If not they should be easy to order.

They are available just hard to find, it took us a couple of months to find our 2024 Tundra with a super crew cab and 6.5' bed. I agree with you, I wouldn't want a pickup with a bed any shorter, most pickups are nothing more than passenger vehicles these days.

 

[Jeremy Kessenich]

There is no rail mount option available for the new Tundra due to the composite bed your only option is for the B&W turnover ball system.

We have a 24 Tundra and a 5.0 which I converted to a gooseneck with the Reese goose box 1600K https://www.etrailer.com/5th-Wheel-Gooseneck-Adapter/Reese/RP94716-61301.html
I really like this system it's really nice to not have a hitch to install and remove and then store when not using it just takes a second to drop in the ball extension that gives tailgate clearance. Tows just like before I can't say it's better in this regard as our 5.0 has always towed like a dream.

Anderson makes a version of their hitch that connects to a goose ball rather than rails https://www.etrailer.com/5th-Wheel-Gooseneck-Adapter/Andersen/AN67VR.htmlView attachment 1939406View attachment 1939407

Do you know what the net weight difference is between the OE pin box and this one? This one weighs 220 lbs, but you don't have the hitch in the bed and I am curious to know what the OE pin box weighs in considering the additional weight. Watching the video on trailer it certainly looks huge!

 

[DanandDaphne]

Do you know what the net weight difference is between the OE pin box and this one? This one weighs 220 lbs, but you don't have the hitch in the bed and I am curious to know what the OE pin box weighs in considering the additional weight. Watching the video on trailer it certainly looks huge!

The Lippert pin box #1716 is right around 100# I never found it's exact weight just a shipping weight of 105# and I haven't put mine on a scale, so it's around 120lbs more with this goose box. It's more than an Anderson weighs but about the same as my previous fifth wheel hitch.

Edit: I just went out and put the Lippert pin box on an old bathroom scale and it weighs 80lbs so the Reese is potentially 140lbs more but I never put the Reese goose box on a scale and the 220 is also shipping weight so it could be off as well.

 

[John in Santa Cruz]

My F150 SuperCab has the 6.5' box. It is crazy that they describe it as a long box. I have had a pickup for the last 40 years and all have had an 8' bed. There is no way I would want to go shorter than a 6.5' bed. Pickups are for carrying things and pulling trailers for me, and even 6.5' is a bit short at times.

The OP says there are no 6.5' beds available. This makes no sense to me as most of the ones for sale around here have them. If not they should be easy to order.

the problem is, too many newer pickup trucks are crewcab 4 door, and that already extends the wheelbase, so combining that with a 8 foot bed would result in a 25 foot long truck, strictly superduty class. My F250 was a 8 foot bed, with a cab-and-a-half, and it was already 21 feet long bumper to bumper.

 

[DanandDaphne]

the problem is, too many newer pickup trucks are crewcab 4 door, and that already extends the wheelbase, so combining that with a 8 foot bed would result in a 25 foot long truck, strictly superduty class. My F250 was a 8 foot bed, with a cab-and-a-half, and it was already 21 feet long bumper to bumper.

For Toyota Tundras the super crew cab with 6.5' bed total length is 245.6" so almost 20.5' The same cab and 5.5' bed is 233.6" so 19.5' The double cab and 6'5' bed is the same wheel base as the super cab and 5.5' bed and overall length of 19.5' The also build a double cab and eight foot bed, total length 252.5'.

It's amazing how much one foot of extra length affects your maneuverability in tight spaces. Tundras already have a poor turning radius the short wheel base is 48' vs F-150s 41' Our truck must be over 50'

 

[iamunique127]

For Toyota Tundras the super crew cab with 6.5' bed total length is 245.6" so almost 20.5' The same cab and 5.5' bed is 233.6" so 19.5' The double cab and 6'5' bed is the same wheel base as the super cab and 5.5' bed and overall length of 19.5' The also build a double cab and eight foot bed, total length 252.5'.

It's amazing how much one foot of extra length affects your maneuverability in tight spaces. Tundras already have a poor turning radius the short wheel base is 48' vs F-150s 41' Our truck must be over 50'

Those are some of the reasons they match a CrewMax cab with a 5.5' box. My current Tundra fits in the same space in the garage as my previous single cab, 8' box truck although I'm not sure of the exact length measurements. In general the manufacturers build trucks in standard configurations so they aren't so unwieldy.

I've always had 8' boxes on my trucks before my short box Tundra. I was initially concerned about functionality but I've been able to make this box work for me no matter the task. YMMV

All the big cab accoutrements do reduce the payload though, so my next Tundra may be a double cab with 6.5' box for higher payload.