Seeking Solutions to Home Power Outage

[brightday]

[FONT=&quot]The Escape provides a lovely respite from power outages that may occur at one’s home, but health issues forced me to sell my little Escape, and Houston has endured two power outages within the space of a month, with more likely to follow. In June, Tropical Storm Alberto split, sheered, and uprooted trees, damaging homes and property with a resulting outage lasted five days. Hurricane Beryl left our neighborhood even more damaged; power has just been restored after nine days. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]During both events, two houses across the street ran gas generators, but my Escape experience has me hoping for a system that uses solar energy, perhaps augmented, if need be, with a gas generator. We’re not looking for a whole-house system, just enough so that power will automatically click in to run our refrigerator/freezer, operate a couple of lamps, and recharge a laptop, Kindle, and small USB fan. The possibilities in such situations are endless (and frankly quite daunting!) which made me think of you; for the Escape community likely has the knowledge and experience needed to provide the best kind of advice when it comes to energy efficiency. Thank you in advance for offering whatever suggestions may occur. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Multiple blessings and safe travels! How I miss being out there among you! [/FONT]

 

[HABBERDABBER]

One possibility

A couple of years ago I purchased a Chevy Bolt EUV electric vehicle. It has a 960 pound, 65 kWh battery for vehicle propulsion. I also purchased a 2,000W pure sine wave inverter to connect to the Bolt. That would run my furnace, refrigerator and lights for quite awhile. It is not a "plug & play" system, and my concern is a Winter ice storm knocking out power for an extended period.

If you have natural gas supply to your home, a stationary natural gas generator is a good choice. No storing of fuel is necessary, and often, natural gas supply is not interrupted in outages. The system can be automatic.

A home battery back-up system is another option. See here:https://www.treehugger.com/best-home-battery-storage-systems-5192244

If you're not in need of AC cooling, a moderately sized battery system is feasible.
None of these options come cheap.

A solar system supplement is nice, but it would need to take up a lot of space to provide a significant amount of power.

Your least expensive option is a gas or diesel fueled generator, but I'm not sure about the automatically engaged feature. A diesel generator is safer for on location fuel storage, but all stored fuels go south with time.

 

[Rossue]

Three years ago when we built our empty Transit T-250 into an Adventure Van we opted to use an "all in one" vs. separate batteries & inverter. We decided on a Goal Zero 3000X and it was $2700 from REI when they had a 20% off sale. We went with GZ primarily due to their reputation for very good customer service and did need some help and got it. Three years later it is working great.

We've used our GZ several times with power outages in the house. Sometimes we will pull out the unit from the van and other times run an extension cord. GZ makes a Home Integration Kit too which allows four circuits to run easily. We have not gone down this road yet, we primarily want to keep the fridge cold and run a few other items which an extension cord and a surge protector with six outlets does the job for us.

The 3000X has been replaced by newer design, however they do have some they are selling as "open box" at nearly 1/2 off.

GZ now has a Home Backup line and includes the transfer switch with 10 circuits available. https://goalzero.com/collections/haven-home-backup-systems/products/4-kwh-haven-home-battery-backup

If buying today I would also look at EcoFlow Delta Pro and they seem to have good reviews as well. https://us.ecoflow.com/products/del...wZ9QN_ZY1__T5GyImjopWvucluIeunukaAve3EALw_wcB

There are others too like Jackery & Bluetti. Pros & cons to each; have to do your own research. I like buying from REI as you have one year to return.

https://www.rei.com/search?q=Goal+Zero+solar+generators

 

[brightday]

If you have natural gas supply to your home, a stationary natural gas generator is a good choice. No storing of fuel is necessary, and often, natural gas supply is not interrupted in outages. The system can be automatic.

A home battery back-up system is another option. See here:https://www.treehugger.com/best-home-battery-storage-systems-5192244

Thanks so much for the thorough response, HABBERDABBER! We have a gas stove, so this option makes sense. I so appreciate the link and all of the information you'd provided and will investigate all options.

 

[brightday]

Three years ago when we built our empty Transit T-250 into an Adventure Van we opted to use an "all in one" vs. separate batteries & inverter. We decided on a Goal Zero 3000X and it was $2700 from REI when they had a 20% off sale. We went with GZ primarily due to their reputation for very good customer service and did need some help and got it. Three years later it is working great....

Thanks for the information and links, ROSSUE! This is along the lines I was thinking, as Escape taught me the value of solar energy, and my daughter is considering it when the roof needs to be replaced. You and HABBERDABBER have provided me with reliable places with which to begin, and I am deeply grateful!

 

[Centex]

Just for your consideration ....

• any 'permanently outside' (e.g. rooftop) solar array is susceptible to storm damage
• any 'permanent' or portable solution dependent on solar for recharge may have limited utility during extended storms / overcast / outages
• any 'portable' solution requires some degree of anticipation-of-need and set-up

Those factors make me inclined to natural-gas powered backup for the worst-case situations (tropical and winter storm-related outages of relatively extended duration) recent history has dealt us in Texas.

They can be sized and configured to support partial or full-house automatic switching per your preference. They require essentially zero maintenance or attention over the long periods between use (don't need to think about maintaining battery charge at all, they typically have an automatic periodic-run function to ensure their starter-batteries are maintained and all is in working-order). They just automatically step-in and 'work' when needed, even for brief outages, and the rest of the time are an essentially passive appliance.

Maybe not the 'greenest' solution, maybe not the least-expensive, but IMO the solution most likely to reliably deliver the electricity when and for however long it's needed with the least-hassle or intervention by me. And when anticipating and wishing to mitigate power-outage disruptions to my life, I would certainly appreciate minimizing hassles and stress factors.

YMMV, as always.

 

[DanandDaphne]

As far as I know any automatic switching is going to require a generator big enough to handle all of the potential loads of your house, and be permanently installed. I have never heard of an automatic system that is only connected to some of the loads.

We have a Champion duel fuel 2500W generator and in an extended power outage we would just run it on propane and run extension cords into the house where we would plug in the refrigerator, chest freezer, and gas furnace (ours is plugged into a standard 120V receptacle) and then a few lamps for light. Our power is pretty reliable so we haven't had to do this but you never know.

So for $500 for the generator, a couple of 20LB propane cylinders, and some extension cords, you would be in business.

 

[bborzell]

As far as I know any automatic switching is going to require a generator big enough to handle all of the potential loads of your house, and be permanently installed. I have never heard of an automatic system that is only connected to some of the loads.

We have a Champion duel fuel 2500W generator and in an extended power outage we would just run it on propane and run extension cords into the house where we would plug in the refrigerator, chest freezer, and gas furnace (ours is plugged into a standard 120V receptacle) and then a few lamps for light. Our power is pretty reliable so we haven't had to do this but you never know.

So for $500 for the generator, a couple of 20LB propane cylinders, and some extension cords, you would be in business.

You can install a permanent generator and wire it through an automatic transfer switch hooked to a single circuit. It would make no sense, but the point is you don’t have to bring in generator power at the service panel.

Many Automatic Transfer Switches have load centers with as many as 20 circuits which can be routed directly to a backup generator.

We have operated with 20 circuits that were rerouted from the primary sub panel to the ATS since 2011.

 

[D&L]

I agree with Alan

Consider all the possibles and usually Murphy's Law is against you. Two years ago I got a Generac automatic switch over on propane. I live in the country with a house well, so I went with a hole house system. If the wife does not have water or electricity, it's not fun around my house. Yes the expense was all worth it. In about twelve seconds the power is back on.

Think about all different systems and the pros and cons of each. Good luck and hope this helps.

Dan

 

[Centex]

As far as I know any automatic switching is going to require a generator big enough to handle all of the potential loads of your house, and be permanently installed. I have never heard of an automatic system that is only connected to some of the loads.

Just FYI, partial-house generator switching is accomplished by moving some circuits from the main to a sub-panel with only the sub-panel subject to the automatic transfer switch (the transfer switch prevents back-feed to the main panel and thence to the 'grid' where it could endanger utility workers).

Yes, this applies to 'permanent' backup-power installations using whatever backup-power source.

The 'value' and 'payback' of partial-house vs whole-house backup depends on the entirety of the customer's situation (loads, needs / wants, goals, etc) but the point of my mention was that the option is available for consideration / evaluation.

It's analogous to my 120VAC main + sub-panel trailer setup with certain circuits (water heater 120VAC, fridge 120VAC, etc) excluded from automatic switchover to battery / inverter support when shore-power is not connected.

 

[Chamberman]

Lower circuit count manual transfer switches are available and are somewhat inexpensive. I've considered installing something like this six circuit unit to connect my generator up to my house. Pick six of your most important circuits, fridges, freezers, air handler/furnace, etc and then you manually switch each individual circuit between generator, OFF, or line power.

If you're handy and capable of installing yourself then with a decent generator you could be set for $1k or so. You'll not be running your home AC or electric furnace for that much money, but most gas furnaces should be no problem with a reasonable sized >2kw continuous generator.

 

[brightday]

Just for your consideration ....

• any 'permanently outside' (e.g. rooftop) solar array is susceptible to storm damage
• any 'permanent' or portable solution dependent on solar for recharge may have limited utility during extended storms / overcast / outages
• any 'portable' solution requires some degree of anticipation-of-need and set-up

Those factors make me inclined to natural-gas powered backup for the worst-case situations (tropical and winter storm-related outages of relatively extended duration) recent history has dealt us in Texas.

They can be sized and configured to support partial or full-house automatic switching per your preference. They require essentially zero maintenance or attention over the long periods between use (don't need to think about maintaining battery charge at all, they typically have an automatic periodic-run function to ensure their starter-batteries are maintained and all is in working-order). They just automatically step-in and 'work' when needed, even for brief outages, and the rest of the time are an essentially passive appliance.

Maybe not the 'greenest' solution, maybe not the least-expensive, but IMO the solution most likely to reliably deliver the electricity when and for however long it's needed with the least-hassle or intervention by me. And when anticipating and wishing to mitigate power-outage disruptions to my life, I would certainly appreciate minimizing hassles and stress factors.

YMMV, as always.

Although this solution may not be as "green" as the Escape with solar panels offered, I love that it provides a high level of relatively hassle-free reliability. We'll need to give this idea serious consideration. Thanks so much!

 

[brightday]

As far as I know any automatic switching is going to require a generator big enough to handle all of the potential loads of your house, and be permanently installed. I have never heard of an automatic system that is only connected to some of the loads.

We have a Champion duel fuel 2500W generator and in an extended power outage we would just run it on propane and run extension cords into the house where we would plug in the refrigerator, chest freezer, and gas furnace (ours is plugged into a standard 120V receptacle) and then a few lamps for light. Our power is pretty reliable so we haven't had to do this but you never know.

So for $500 for the generator, a couple of 20LB propane cylinders, and some extension cords, you would be in business.

DanandDaphne, your solution makes excellent economic sense! After all, we already have everything mentioned except for the generator. I'm just not sure that I'm agile enough at this point (after a stroke) to negotiate around extension cords. That said, should a serious storm approach Houston before we have something more permanent figured out, we may find ourselves buying a generator and running extension cords! Thanks so much for taking the time to respond!

 

[brightday]

You can install a permanent generator and wire it through an automatic transfer switch hooked to a single circuit. It would make no sense, but the point is you don’t have to bring in generator power at the service panel.

Many Automatic Transfer Switches have load centers with as many as 20 circuits which can be routed directly to a backup generator.

We have operated with 20 circuits that were rerouted from the primary sub panel to the ATS since 2011.

Thanks for the suggestion, bborzell! I'll share it with those who will be helping me to decide what will work best in our situation.

 

[brightday]

I agree with Alan

Consider all the possibles and usually Murphy's Law is against you. Two years ago I got a Generac automatic switch over on propane. I live in the country with a house well, so I went with a hole house system. If the wife does not have water or electricity, it's not fun around my house. Yes the expense was all worth it. In about twelve seconds the power is back on.

Think about all different systems and the pros and cons of each. Good luck and hope this helps.

Dan

Thanks for your thoughts, Dan. Right now we're thinking of this as a "camping-out-at-home" solution, which is definitely tolerable for us in short term situations. (My daughter spends her days in her downtown office, where power is generally restored rather quickly.) I don't mind camping out at home as long as extremes of weather aren't at issue, but they generally are when hurricanes hit or temperatures drop below freezing. I'd also prefer never again having to toss out food from the refrigerator/freezer, especially when restaurants all around us are also closed. For such times, an alternate power source is much needed.

PS: This reluctant city dweller is envying your country life, Dan! Enjoy!

 

[brightday]

Just FYI, partial-house generator switching is accomplished by moving some circuits from the main to a sub-panel .....[continuing]

I will share what you've written with our electrician when it gets to that point, Alan. Thanks so much for taking the time to clarify!

 

[brightday]

Lower circuit count manual transfer switches are available and are somewhat inexpensive. I've considered installing something like this six circuit unit to connect my generator up to my house. Pick six of your most important circuits, fridges, freezers, air handler/furnace, etc and then you manually switch each individual circuit between generator, OFF, or line power.

If you're handy and capable of installing yourself then with a decent generator you could be set for $1k or so. You'll not be running your home AC or electric furnace for that much money, but most gas furnaces should be no problem with a reasonable sized >2kw continuous generator.

This is an interesting idea, Chamberman, and it may be the most affordable to achieve the results we seek, though we’d need to figure in the cost of the electrician needed to install the circuit transfer switch, as we're not quite that handy. Thanks for providing the link!

All things being equal at this point in the discussion, I’d opt for the natural-gas powered backup system proposed by Centex (Alan E.) not only because of its reliability and relative ease of use, but because it can also be configured to support a partial-house setup. Of course, all things in this world are not equal. I’ll need determine the relative costs and benefits of both systems in order to decide which is best for our situation. Thanks so much for adding this valuable piece of information to the discussion!



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[Chamberman]

This is an interesting idea, Chamberman, and it may be the most affordable to achieve the results we seek, though we’d need to figure in the cost of the electrician needed to install the circuit transfer switch, as we're not quite that handy. Thanks for providing the link!

All things being equal at this point in the discussion, I’d opt for the natural-gas powered backup system proposed by Centex (Alan E.) not only because of its reliability and relative ease of use, but because it can also be configured to support a partial-house setup. Of course, all things in this world are not equal. I’ll need determine the relative costs and benefits of both systems in order to decide which is best for our situation. Thanks so much for adding this valuable piece of information to the discussion!
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To give you an idea of a turn-key automatic solution. One of the deal sites I frequent posted a link to a Generac sale at Northern Tool a few days ago. Here's the link, the price is currently 10% off of the equipment or $5850. This system is rated for 21kW running on nat. gas and includes a 200A transfer switch. Based on comments from other posters on that forum and the equipment installation quotes they received the average is at least the same amount as the equipment (add $6k), but some folks reported being quoted > $10k for installation of this system. So YMMV for sure on total costs because there are so many variables there, but you can expect that this whole house system will cost you well over $10k total.


My father lives in the woods on the west of Houston out near Needville. He loses power all the time at his house and he was without power for 6 days after this last storm. In the past he has used a 2kw Yamaha gen, but he recently added a large Jackery solar generator and 400W of portable solar panels. This allows him to operate his two fridges off of solar off/on and switch to the Yamaha gen when the Jackery batteries are running low. So he's running his house much like most people run their RV's when boondocking.

I noticed you mentioned having a stroke.
My father is 86 now and had a stroke last summer which slowed him down a lot and he lost most of the use of his left hand. He's luckily still able to connect cords and start the gas generator. He switched to using smaller gas cans because he was having trouble with the large 5gal cans, but YMMV and only you can determine which of the options everyone has presented will work for you.

 

[DanandDaphne]

It sounds like a larger investment would serve you better the generator that Chamberman listed might allow you to run your AC. Living in Houston that could literally be a life saver if you are having a heat wave at the same time as a power outage.

As we get older we don't handle heat as well as we did when younger and heatstroke is a bigger threat. I guess you could just get a small window AC unit and keep one room cool with a smaller generator.

 

[Centex]

Don't know if your heat is natural gas or heat pump, but if anticipating another 'Texas snowmageddon' you'll likely want to consider the electric demands for home heating even if willing to forego summer AC.

Yeah, I know, hard to remember / think about that on this hot July 19th!