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Old 12-31-2014, 07:40 PM   #31
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There are so many variables in truck ownership that are not within my control, so I focused on the ones that I control and mean the most to me. The looks of a truck matter. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and the Ram is the sharpest truck in my eye. Resale helps too. Diesels have better resale, especially with high(er) mileage (over 100,000 miles) and maintenance records.

I traded my luxury SUV for this truck and my insurance went down over $75/month. Maintenance us lower too. The Eco diesel takes 9 quarts of oil. My Dakota took 6. 3quarts of oil won't break me.

RBryan4 said it well. It's what YOU like in a truck most. I've always been a bow tie (Chevy) guy and it was the look and feel of the Ram that impressed me. Time will tell and there will be more improvements in trucks and cars. We'll see what the future holds in due time.
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Old 01-01-2015, 04:15 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbryan4 View Post
We did an an analysis of the ROI point with a Ram EcoDiesel vs an F150 EcoBoost.

Assuming that:

- the Ram will give us around 18 MPG when towing
- the F150 will give us around 16 MPG when towing
- the Ram is considerably more expensive than the F150
- Diesel fuel in the States is much higher than Gasoline

It would take us over 10 years to reach the 'break even' point in terms of total fuel costs. Of course, the Diesels are reliable, so perhaps the Ram would have a slight advantage over the F150 in terms of maintenance, but to us that's negligible.
Good stuff.
Diesels are no more reliable than comparable gasoline engines (that is, don't compare a locomotive engine to a Ferrari), and maintenance costs of light truck and car diesels are higher than those for gasoline, so maintenance may tip the balance even further toward the F-150. On the other hand, the turbos and direct injection system of the EcoBoost may make it almost as bad as a turbodiesel.

The Ram 1500 turbodiesel is from VM Motori, which has a long history including industrial and commercial engines, but the one in the Ram 1500 (and Grand Cherokee) is a car engine. That's not a criticism at all, just an explanation of why it should not be expected to be like the Cummins ISB variant found in a Ram 2500/3500.

Diesel is on the average more expensive than gasoline here in Canada, too, although the difference seems to be seasonal - that is, seasonal price patterns are different for the two fuels, so the difference between them varies with season. Both are driven by demand, with diesel affected by heating oil demand, but the high-demand/expensive season for gasoline is summer, and the high-demand/expensive season for diesel is winter. If a gasoline engine needs premium, that could wipe out the price difference.
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Old 01-01-2015, 04:30 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
The nice thing about diesel is you can get a repair at any truck stop.
There isn't much in common between a light-duty diesel in a car or Ram 1500 and the commercial-duty diesel in a heavy truck, so I wouldn't count on any truck stop to be able to fix the Ram EcoDiesel any more than I would expect a Ford dealer to to be able to fix a Chevy. In both cases the operating principles are the same and a decent mechanic can figure out any brand, but the ability to efficiently fix is dependent on detailed knowledge (the online manuals), some special tools, and specific parts. The days of mechanical injection pumps looking much alike in a Mercedes or in a big truck are long gone.
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Old 01-01-2015, 07:53 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
Good stuff.
Diesels are no more reliable than comparable gasoline engines (that is, don't compare a locomotive engine to a Ferrari), and maintenance costs of light truck and car diesels are higher than those for gasoline, so maintenance may tip the balance even further toward the F-150. On the other hand, the turbos and direct injection system of the EcoBoost may make it almost as bad as a turbodiesel.

The Ram 1500 turbodiesel is from VM Motori, which has a long history including industrial and commercial engines, but the one in the Ram 1500 (and Grand Cherokee) is a car engine. That's not a criticism at all, just an explanation of why it should not be expected to be like the Cummins ISB variant found in a Ram 2500/3500.

Diesel is on the average more expensive than gasoline here in Canada, too, although the difference seems to be seasonal - that is, seasonal price patterns are different for the two fuels, so the difference between them varies with season. Both are driven by demand, with diesel affected by heating oil demand, but the high-demand/expensive season for gasoline is summer, and the high-demand/expensive season for diesel is winter. If a gasoline engine needs premium, that could wipe out the price difference.
That's very interesting about the engine being ,made for a car.I owned pretty well all of GM's diesel's,. From the 350 conversion to a diesel,the 6.2,6.5 .There best was & still is imo is the duramax/Allison power plant.Saying that I would never own one now.Fuel costs,additive,maintainence on these type of engines is outrageous.I live in Alberta,where fuel should be cheap.At it's highest,which is usually wintertime.The norm for fuel,prior to this recent blip[oil],was $1.45 a liter.I drive the eco tech 5.3 & get 14.2 per/100km,or approx.20 mpg empty.Towing my 21' trailer,i would guess perhaps 15mpg.My Duramax got 20mpg all the time loaded or empty.Don't get me wrong there are places for diesels.I think the beaurgrats have to get after the oil co.to lower the diesel costs.Especially when it [diesel] is cheaper to make..When dodge get's a whole lot more time/miles on these engines.Maybe I might[slim] chance that I would buy one.
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Old 01-01-2015, 09:55 AM   #35
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Diesel Engine

Two weeks ago we traded in our 2011 Ram 1500 SLT for a 2014 Ram 1500 Big Horn.
We bought the Hemi engine with the 8 speed transmission and 3.92 rear end . We went to 4 dealers which had a total of 3 Eco Diesels , and the lowest MSRP of the 3 diesels was $50 K.
We really liked the Ram 1500 Eco Diesel but none of the dealers were giving any discounts on the diesel . The cost difference for liked equipped /optioned trucks was over $8k between the diesel and the gas Hemi plus with the $1 higher cost per gallon for diesel fuel ,we could not justify buying the diesel. We realize that diesel engines have greater longetivity but living in the frozen North where road salt is used , vehicles rust away long before most engines wear out. The other problem we encountered with the diesel was service . We live in a rural area and services are limited . The closest repair garage ,that would /could service the diesel engine was 40 miles away . We plan on waiting a couple years and revisiting the purchase of a small diesel truck .
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Old 01-01-2015, 12:08 PM   #36
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Great input and opinions from everyone. Most everyone I spoke to that owns a diesel was very happy with it. Ownership mostly was from a need for a diesel, whether work, or towing/hauling something.

Fuel prices fluctuate pretty drastically in different parts of the world and what may work for one, may not work for another. There's many choices out there too. Diesel, gas, propane, hybrid, methenal, etc. I've never owned a diesel before, and not getting the V8 growl was a loss, but I spoke to people that like the sound of a diesel too. Somewhat like your preference in music. What sounds cool to you?

Most all of us tow our glass house and want to keep costs down and still have a reliable, comfortable tow vehicle. I've never been there, but I understand Diesel engines are more prevelant in Europe than here. Those I spoke to that own diesel cars, such as a VW report as much as 50 MPG and average maintained costs. My diesel adventure is just starting.

Anyone own an alternative fuel tug, such as propane, bio, methanol, etc?
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Old 01-01-2015, 02:41 PM   #37
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We owned a Jeep GC diesel which had a 6 cylinder CRD in it. We debated the hemi versus the diesel and went with the diesel. I used to pull a heavy boat with it and the torque the engine produced was excellent for towing. The reliability and additional costs to maintain wasn't (about 3 times greater than our current V6 gas engine). The extra $$ saved on better mileage was offset by the higher cost of diesel. We broke down twice, once in a remote area and the nearest Chrysler dealer took 7 days to repair it - waiting for parts from Calgary and only one trained mechanic able to do the job at the dealer. Even on warranty Chrysler did not pickup the costs for a rental and hotel while we waited for the repair. Could have got a lemon but not happy with the service from Chrysler. My neighbour is a diesel mechanic and his truck is a V8 gas.
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Old 01-01-2015, 03:30 PM   #38
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Without knocking any ones choice of engine the one thing I don't understand is why there is such a difference in gas and diesel fuel. Right now diesel is $1.00 more than gas and on a 20 gal. fill, this would bite. That has pretty much been the spread all last year. Gas today by my house is $1.89. Loren
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Old 01-01-2015, 03:36 PM   #39
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Great comments from everyone's experience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WLYBGR View Post
I think the beaurgrats have to get after the oil co.to lower the diesel costs.Especially when it [diesel] is cheaper to make.
The bureaucrats don't set prices; costs and consumers do. While the diesel of decades ago was cheaper to make than gasoline, I doubt today's ultra low sulphur product is cheap - it is a tightly specified product like gasoline. Ever since the start of the emission regulations for diesels which have been phased in over the last decade, diesel is no longer that cheap "unrefined" fuel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gharper View Post
We owned a Jeep GC diesel which had a 6 cylinder CRD in it.
That 2007 was the previous generation of Grand Cherokee diesel, which used the Mercedes 3.0CRD V6 (Mercedes engine code OM642). This is the same engine as the second-generation Sprinter commercial van, but rated at much lower power output in commercial vehicles (161 hp versus 215 hp in the Jeep). I believe that this is the engine which would likely be in the Grand Cherokee and Ram 1500 today, if Chrysler had not been dumped by Daimler and picked up by Fiat.
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Old 01-01-2015, 03:38 PM   #40
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It has been that way since sometime in 2004 when diesel became more expensive due to the middle east crisis. Since then it has cost more.
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