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Old 12-22-2016, 05:48 AM   #1
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Tran cooler on 2013 Tacoma

I've looked and did not find this so decided to ask.
We have a 2013 Tacoma with the factory towing package. It's rated at 6400 Lbs so the 19 we will pick up next year is within capacity . I've looked at the factory transmission cooler on it and wonder if it is large enough. If you have a similar setup did your transmission stay under 250F in the mountains? That's the warning light temp per the manual. I do have a scangauge with the Transmission temp display so I can watch it.
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Old 12-22-2016, 06:08 AM   #2
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I've looked and did not find this so decided to ask.
We have a 2013 Tacoma with the factory towing package. It's rated at 6400 Lbs so the 19 we will pick up next year is within capacity . I've looked at the factory transmission cooler on it and wonder if it is large enough. If you have a similar setup did your transmission stay under 250F in the mountains? That's the warning light temp per the manual. I do have a scangauge with the Transmission temp display so I can watch it.
I would recommend you change it out to a larger unit. I have a 2011 Tacoma and a 19 . When towing on the hills and such up into Maine in the warm weather the transmission was getting close to the break down point of the fluid about 300 deg for the WS Fluid in an automatic 4x4 Tacoma. I swapped mine out for a Hayden Automotive 678 Rapid-Cool Plate and Fin Transmission Cooler.

Stop over at www.tacomaworld.com and check out the towing bible etc. You can find just about any question you have answered there. There are folks here who will chime in with an opinion but not own the vehicle and have nothing but Google's information to base their opinion on .


You may want to consider firestone air bags for the back even with a WD /Sway hitch the Tacoma's have notoriously soft rear suspension and will porpoise a little even with the WD . You might also consider a hitch scale or dummy up one to test your load out once you get it right your good but the first few times you may have to adjust the position of things in the camper and in the bed of the truck.


I also installed the PROEFX towing mirrors they are a direct replacement for the Tacoma Mirrors with upgrades such as heat and turn signals . The vendor is listed on Tacoma world.

Cypherian here and There
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Old 12-22-2016, 11:25 AM   #3
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To add some confusion I have a different opinion. I have a 2013 Tacoma with the towing package and automatic transmission, the same truck you have. I'm even a fellow Floridian. I was told that the transmission fluid in the Tacoma is synthetic, so it will take a higher temperature before breaking down. I have a Scan Gauge to monitor its temperature.

I've towed my Escape 21 back from B.C. to Florida, there and back again, and to Maine and back, plus other trips. So that means a few trips over mountain ranges. The only transmission-related issue I've noticed is that the day after a day of towing the truck sometimes feels "bumpy" at slow speeds. I had a dealer check it out and found no problem. I've decided that the bumping is caused by the transmission "relearning" that it isn't towing anymore and no longer has that load to pull. I'm just guessing.

From my experience I believe that the Tacoma's factory-equipped towing package is adequate and a replacement cooler isn't needed.
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Old 12-22-2016, 11:31 AM   #4
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Also, my transmission temperature went over 200 a few times when I was in the mountains, but the warning light never came on, so I guess it didn't get to 250 degrees. I don't remember it doing so, anyway.

Sorry I didn't answer this before-- when I'm typing my blather I can no longer see the original question.
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Old 12-22-2016, 11:55 AM   #5
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Modern transmission on newer vehicles use synthetic transmission fluid and run hotter than the transmissions of old . My truck bypasses the transmission cooler when it's cold so the fluid heats up to the proper level. My transmission often runs over 200 deg in the summer when towing
Toyota rated your truck with the factory transmission cooler for towing 6400 lbs. What makes you think the factory cooler is insufficient or inadequate ? If the Toyota engineers were correct when they sized the transmission cooler , will you by adding additional transmission cooling create a problem .
I think you have a legitimate question that may be best answered by Toyota or a reputable transmission shop
I realize that a Tacoma is a small truck and pulling a 19 is at the trucks upper limits but I doubt Toyota lied about its ' towing capacity or cheated on the size,of the transmission cooler.

Tow your 19 around for a while and see what temps your transmission runs . You may discover that you don't need an aftermarket cooler .
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Old 12-22-2016, 12:07 PM   #6
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2013 V6Taco with factory tow pkg; never had a hot trannie hauling our 21 over the mountains.
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Old 12-22-2016, 03:32 PM   #7
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Thank you, I looked at the towing bible but found the ones asking about a transmission cooler either did not have one or were wanting to tow over the limit. I'll give it a try and watch it. We already have air bags and strap on mirrors so we should be set. Come on March ( and nice weather !!! )
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Old 12-22-2016, 04:08 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tractors1 View Post
2013 V6Taco with factory tow pkg; never had a hot trannie hauling our 21 over the mountains.
Hi: tractors1... Never had a hot tranny hauling over the mountains, but did have a hot ascend a few times!!! Alf
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Old 12-22-2016, 04:22 PM   #9
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Everything Steve said makes sense to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wetzk View Post
We have a 2013 Tacoma with the factory towing package. It's rated at 6400 Lbs so the 19 we will pick up next year is within capacity . I've looked at the factory transmission cooler on it and wonder if it is large enough.
Toyota thinks it's large enough. And they actually test the vehicle according to the SAE J2807 standard.

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Originally Posted by Cypherian View Post
I would recommend you change it out to a larger unit.
It looks like the Tacoma with a towing package includes a completely separate unit from the radiator, possibly as well as a coil within the cool-side tank of the radiator (included with most automatic-transmission vehicles). The stock external cooler could be replaced with a larger one, but I think it's important to make sure that any change does not change the fluid flow path because transmission fluid is supposed to be warm, and the original design includes a thermostat to ensure that it the fluid is not over-cooled.

Also, aftermarket parts are often junk, so I would want to see any larger unit to ensure that it is properly designed and will actually increase cooling capacity (and not fail).

I wouldn't consider changing the cooler unless I had observed higher fluid temperatures than I found acceptable.
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Old 12-22-2016, 04:42 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by tractors1 View Post
2013 V6Taco with factory tow pkg; never had a hot trannie hauling our 21 over the mountains.
Do you have a temp gauge for your transmission ?

The temps I saw towing a 19 up and down anywhere from 7% to 15% grades at 85 Deg F ambient temp with the a/c running not in overdrive as you shouldn't be when towing, went from 230 Deg F to 250 Deg F.The WS fluid starts to break down at 300 Deg F . I weighed in at 8730 lbs on the scales. Everyone has their comfort zone mine is not to heat my fluid up that much that many times since it is a major PITA to drain and fill on change out.

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Old 12-22-2016, 05:05 PM   #11
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Everything Steve said makes sense to me.


Toyota thinks it's large enough. And they actually test the vehicle according to the SAE J2807 standard.


It looks like the Tacoma with a towing package includes a completely separate unit from the radiator, possibly as well as a coil within the cool-side tank of the radiator (included with most automatic-transmission vehicles). The stock external cooler could be replaced with a larger one, but I think it's important to make sure that any change does not change the fluid flow path because transmission fluid is supposed to be warm, and the original design includes a thermostat to ensure that it the fluid is not over-cooled.

Also, aftermarket parts are often junk, so I would want to see any larger unit to ensure that it is properly designed and will actually increase cooling capacity (and not fail).

I wouldn't consider changing the cooler unless I had observed higher fluid temperatures than I found acceptable.
Yes Brian I always trust engineers .. not. They can not possibly test for every possible scenario the variables would be immense and always come right back to whose foot is on the pedal and driving style. You have to take into account fuel type, load on vehicle, load on trailer, road type, road grade, ambient air temp, barometric pressure, altitude, proper maintenance of vehicle and trailer, air pressure in tires, type of tires , compound of tires, wind direction and speed, aerodynamics of camper, items on roof of truck the coefficients of drag on those items .. shall I go on ?

Since you do not own a Tacoma or an Escape your answers come from the brochures and company supplied information. And companies never lie or stretch the truth when was the last time you got the mileage as quoted on the window sticker of a vehicle or the manufacturers website.

Hayden if you do your research via google has been around for 40 plus years . I and many other people who I use to drag race with use their products at least at the non pro level. Do not get me wrong there are other manufacturers out there that are just as good that is just the one I used and many other owners of TACOMA'S. As for a product failing lol when does a light bulb burn out ? Anything can and will fail you just choose the best you can and go with it, after proper research and such.

Toyota will also tell you it is ok to put your boat in the water after driving a 100 miles .. What they don't tell you is the rear end pumpkin vent is at the axle tube height. You risk sucking water in the rear end if you back in to far to fast cooling the pumpkin off to quick sucking the valve open from the inside. You learn these little things when you own and maintain a vehicle.

I am glad the OP will monitor it and with luck never have to worry over it. I do hope the mirrors you have work I tried a few that were mentioned here and on Tacoma world they vibrated to much for me.

To sit and google search and then spout the company line after reading what the company says is tantamount to 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'.

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Old 12-22-2016, 06:03 PM   #12
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I don't get it. You don't trust Toyota, but you trust Hayden and the manufacturer of your temp gauge.
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Old 12-22-2016, 06:21 PM   #13
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I agree that there are many factors contributing to vehicle load and transmission fluid temperature, but I don't see a reason to assume that a company selling transmission fluid coolers has better accounted for this than a company which designs and builds (and covers with warranty) vehicles. I think the many of person-years of experience in the SAE (which established J2807) are worth listening to. Of course actual temperature observations (such as those provided by Mike, and that we have encouraged Karen - the original poster - to get) are very relevant.

Toyota decided that for towing duty an external transmission fluid cooler is appropriate, and they provided it (as shown in Toyota parts diagrams). If they under-sized it, then the fluid will run too hot and a larger cooler is appropriate.

Escapes and Bolers are not identical, but I don't see how they differ in any way relevant to Tacoma transmission cooling.

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I don't get it. You don't trust Toyota, but you trust Hayden...
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Old 12-22-2016, 06:24 PM   #14
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I was going to comment about my experiences with towing when we had a 2008 Tacoma, but I think I'll just watch from the sidelines instead......
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Old 12-22-2016, 06:28 PM   #15
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I was going to comment about my experiences with towing when we had a 2008 Tacoma...
I'm interested
2008 and 2013 Tacomas are the same generation, with similar transmission cooling.
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Old 12-22-2016, 06:48 PM   #16
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Ok, we had the standard tow package, but were only towing a 17B not a 19. We did a lot of traveling through mountainous areas. I didn't have a scan gauge, so I can't give any actual temp readings, but never once in any long climbing mountain passes did the trans temp light even flicker. I tend to view Toyota as a VERY cautious company that is very sensitive about its image. I personally can't see that company ever putting in an undersized transmission cooler, but that is my own biased opinion.

Ok, I have no bones to pick either way in this, so climbing back up into the stands with my popcorn now.
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Old 12-22-2016, 07:43 PM   #17
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I had a Hayden transmission cooler professionally installed in my 1999 truck.
It worked well in the Summer . In the winter it worked too well.
Solved one problem , Created another .

I am from the old school in that I believe the old adage. " If it ain't broke don't fix it" or "You can't fix it if it ain't broke"

I am not a fan of Toyota , never owned one , never will , but I know they did not get to be one of the world's largest auto manufacturers by consistently building shoddy products or constantly lying to the public.
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Old 12-22-2016, 08:21 PM   #18
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Before our current truck, we towed our 21' over 20,000 miles as high as 11,000+ feet in the Rockies with our 2003 4Runner, a mildly similar vehicle--V6 and rated at 6400lbs. after the addition of a more substantial receiver-hitch to match what would have come on a V8.
Since it didn't have an external trans cooler, I added one (probably Hayden) and monitored with a Scanguage II. Reading the temps was only part of the equasion, the other part is adopting a suitable max temp that you feel comfortable with. The Valvoline tech that I contacted said he'd gear down, slow down or otherwise ease off at 240F. I never went over 230F. Gearing down had an almost instantaneous cooling effect.
If I had it to do over again I'd select a fan powered external cooler, but with a 19' I'd think you'd be fine with just monitoring, especially if you Tacoma does in fact have the external cooler.
As a safety valve, don't forget the age-old extra radiator every car has---turn on your heater on full blast regardless of the season. It actually does help, especially with the trans cooler my old 4Runner came with that goes through the side tank of the radiator. Dropping the coolant temperature also dropped the trans temp.

Good luck.
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Old 12-22-2016, 09:19 PM   #19
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Gbaglo:
I don't get it. You don't trust Toyota,but you trust Hayden and the manufacturer of your temp gauge.
Cypher :No not really I trust Toyota to do whatthey can to make a decent product but also make a decent bottom line. I dotrust what I have firsthand experience with Hayden and the temps my transmissiongot to while it was hooked up to scan gauge , inline mechanical autometer transtemp gauge and later my obd scanner live capture mode and autometer gauge. Theyall stayed with in a 3-5 degree temp range of each other.
Brian B-P
I agree that there are many factorscontributing to vehicle load and transmission fluid temperature, but I don'tsee a reason to assume that a company selling transmission fluid coolers hasbetter accounted for this than a company which designs and builds (and coverswith warranty) vehicles. I think the many of person-years of experience in theSAE (which established J2807) are worth listening to. Of course actualtemperature observations (such as those provided by Mike, and that we haveencouraged Karen - the original poster - to get) are very relevant.

Toyota decided that for towing duty an external transmission fluid cooler isappropriate, and they provided it (as shown in Toyota parts diagrams). If theyunder-sized it, then the fluid will run too hot and a larger cooler isappropriate.

Escapes and Bolers are not identical, but I don't see how they differ in anyway relevant to Tacoma transmission cooling.


Cypher : I never stated as such I stated that isthe maker of the one I choose from REAL WORLD experience with them and from othersalso using them. I said there are other makers that are just as good. I could care less what SAE J2807 contains Ihave the temps I observed with three different methods I will go with the realworld I live in not a perfect environment /driver /vehicle setup world thatengineers would use for expediency of testing and 1000’s iterations of any test parameters done in minutes notmonths.
I would guess no there isn’t muchdifference in the Escape or Boler except ohh weight and balance, aerodynamics ,rolling resistance loads but since the question was asked about a Tacoma and aEscape 19 It would probably be best to have owners of that setup answer thequestion since it is the OP’s question .



Thoer:

Cypher: Iposted my experience I would hesitate to rely on the AT light as it comes on at284 Deg F on the transfer case and 275 Deg F for the transmission and will stayon till the temps drop 30 to 40 or so degrees. Everything I can find about the transmissionfluid that is in the Tacoma says 300 is breakdown I have looked and looked fora hard number direct from Toyota or the actual maker to no avail.

SteveD:

had a Hayden transmission coolerprofessionally installed in my 1999 truck.
It worked well in the Summer . In the winter it worked too well.
Solved one problem , Created another .

I am from the old school in that I believe the old adage. " If it ain'tbroke don't fix it" or "You can't fix it if it ain't broke"

I am not a fan of Toyota , never owned one , never will , but I know they didnot get to be one of the world's largest auto manufacturers by consistentlybuilding shoddy products or constantly lying to the public.

Cypher : Yeah that can be a problem there is afine line between cooling and to much cooling lol . I have my readings and experienceso I changed it and no issues since . The OP asked about a particular setupthough IE Tacoma and 19 ft escape so I answered from my REAL world experience.And as has been shown others with the same or very very similar setups haveshown different experiences hence I directed them to the forum dedicated to theTacoma’s.
I am by no means a fan boy I could listhalf a dozen things they should have done or very easily do to make life simplefor owners number one being bring the dang HI Lux to this country !!! lol
And I am done with the discussion OP I amsorry others took this thread a whole other direction if you are good with yoursetup great enjoy your truck and your Escape see you on the road :}

Cypher
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Old 12-22-2016, 09:24 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by cypherian View Post
gbaglo:
i don't get it. You don't trust toyota,but you trust hayden and the manufacturer of your temp gauge.
cypher :no not really i trust toyota to do whatthey can to make a decent product but also make a decent bottom line. I dotrust what i have firsthand experience with hayden and the temps my transmissiongot to while it was hooked up to scan gauge , inline mechanical autometer transtemp gauge and later my obd scanner live capture mode and autometer gauge. Theyall stayed with in a 3-5 degree temp range of each other.
brian b-p
i agree that there are many factorscontributing to vehicle load and transmission fluid temperature, but i don'tsee a reason to assume that a company selling transmission fluid coolers hasbetter accounted for this than a company which designs and builds (and coverswith warranty) vehicles. I think the many of person-years of experience in thesae (which established j2807) are worth listening to. Of course actualtemperature observations (such as those provided by mike, and that we haveencouraged karen - the original poster - to get) are very relevant.

Toyota decided that for towing duty an external transmission fluid cooler isappropriate, and they provided it (as shown in toyota parts diagrams). If theyunder-sized it, then the fluid will run too hot and a larger cooler isappropriate.

Escapes and bolers are not identical, but i don't see how they differ in anyway relevant to tacoma transmission cooling.


cypher : I never stated as such i stated that isthe maker of the one i choose from real world experience with them and from othersalso using them. I said there are other makers that are just as good. I could care less what sae j2807 contains ihave the temps i observed with three different methods i will go with the realworld i live in not a perfect environment /driver /vehicle setup world thatengineers would use for expediency of testing and 1000ís iterations of any test parameters done in minutes notmonths.
i would guess no there isnít muchdifference in the escape or boler except ohh weight and balance, aerodynamics ,rolling resistance loads but since the question was asked about a tacoma and aescape 19 it would probably be best to have owners of that setup answer thequestion since it is the opís question .



thoer:

cypher: Iposted my experience i would hesitate to rely on the at light as it comes on at284 deg f on the transfer case and 275 deg f for the transmission and will stayon till the temps drop 30 to 40 or so degrees. Everything i can find about the transmissionfluid that is in the tacoma says 300 is breakdown i have looked and looked fora hard number direct from toyota or the actual maker to no avail.

steved:

had a hayden transmission coolerprofessionally installed in my 1999 truck.
It worked well in the summer . In the winter it worked too well.
Solved one problem , created another .

I am from the old school in that i believe the old adage. " if it ain'tbroke don't fix it" or "you can't fix it if it ain't broke"

i am not a fan of toyota , never owned one , never will , but i know they didnot get to be one of the world's largest auto manufacturers by consistentlybuilding shoddy products or constantly lying to the public.

cypher : Yeah that can be a problem there is afine line between cooling and to much cooling lol . I have my readings and experienceso i changed it and no issues since . The op asked about a particular setupthough ie tacoma and 19 ft escape so i answered from my real world experience.and as has been shown others with the same or very very similar setups haveshown different experiences hence i directed them to the forum dedicated to thetacomaís.
i am by no means a fan boy i could listhalf a dozen things they should have done or very easily do to make life simplefor owners number one being bring the dang hi lux to this country !!! Lol
and i am done with the discussion op i amsorry others took this thread a whole other direction if you are good with yoursetup great enjoy your truck and your escape see you on the road :}

cypher
merry christmas
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