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07-09-2015, 12:06 AM
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#181
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Site Team
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Canyon Lake, Texas
Trailer: 2015 19 "Past Tents", 2021 F150 Lariat 2.7L EB
Posts: 10,222
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Dometic knows their sn rated fridges cannot perform well when the temps are above 85F. They've made several business decisions to not sell a t rated or even st rated fridge in North America -- at least not anything like the 8 series. Have no idea why. Norcold is basically doing the same thing. Anyone want to corner the rv fridge market? Just start producing a t rated fridge line in the north American market -- one that performs well up to 104F. They do make them. They just dont sell them here.
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"You can't buy happiness, but you can buy an RV. And that is pretty close."
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07-09-2015, 12:49 AM
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#182
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Ventura County, California
Trailer: 2013 19 Escape
Posts: 7,203
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron in BC
I have the 4.3.
My rational for this mod was two fold.
I had to replace the baffle anyway as it was covered in mold. I could have just used 1/8" plywood but since aluminum is just as easy to use, will never get moldy and lends itself to what I wanted to do I used aluminum.
One. I wanted a smooth flow of convection air to remove heat from the condenser. Given the convoluted area around the condenser is likely to create turbulence and an inefficient flow of air I added some fins to "straighten" the flow and make it more efficient. I was't looking to create hurricane alley but I did want a more efficient convection current.
Secondly, it made no sense to me that the heat from the flame is dumped out right by the condenser, an area you want to remove heat from, not add heat to.
So the channel on the left creates a flue that is isolated from the condenser. Ironically Dometic does make a flue extension that directly dumps the heat to the exterior. Efforts to obtain on in North America weren't successful so I went with the isolated flue instead.
Ron
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Thanks Ron for info . You are right I found that extension pipe (tomorrow will put it on thread ) in Australia , not here . I don't know about this metal on back of my frig , but Reace
was adamant I put it back , so I did . I think I can get it off if I need to without pulling frig . Do you have figures for your outside temps on your trip ? Very interested what you were dealing with . Pat
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07-09-2015, 01:39 AM
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#183
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Ventura County, California
Trailer: 2013 19 Escape
Posts: 7,203
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lorrie
You make a point Donna, but I don' think that will be enough to console the people who shelled out big $ and have to worry about fridge cooling. If I was them I would be disappointed that ETI hasn't found another supplier. I don't think ETI has changed supplier/brand of fridge, and to keep installing a product proven defective just doesn't make sense to me.
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Thank you for voicing our frustration . Most people keep quiet and do not want to make waves . We are just at a point trying to help this situation on our own with orthers valuable help. I would just say we are dealing at this point . It's hard to look at a brand new frig that doesn't work . Pat
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07-09-2015, 08:01 AM
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#184
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Marana, Arizona
Trailer: 2018 Airstream Flying Cloud (Escape 19 & 5.0 previously)
Posts: 1,078
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron in BC
I have the 4.3.
My rational for this mod was two fold.
I had to replace the baffle anyway as it was covered in mold. I could have just used 1/8" plywood but since aluminum is just as easy to use, will never get moldy and lends itself to what I wanted to do I used aluminum.
One. I wanted a smooth flow of convection air to remove heat from the condenser. Given the convoluted area around the condenser is likely to create turbulence and an inefficient flow of air I added some fins to "straighten" the flow and make it more efficient. I was't looking to create hurricane alley but I did want a more efficient convection current.
Secondly, it made no sense to me that the heat from the flame is dumped out right by the condenser, an area you want to remove heat from, not add heat to.
So the channel on the left creates a flue that is isolated from the condenser. Ironically Dometic does make a flue extension that directly dumps the heat to the exterior. Efforts to obtain on in North America weren't successful so I went with the isolated flue instead.
Ron
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Wow, nice work Ron. Were you a Tin Knocker in a previous life?
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07-09-2015, 08:04 AM
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#185
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico
Trailer: 2013 Escape 19
Posts: 247
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Pat,
That is one of the nicest insulation jobs I've ever seen! A couple questions, I see you didn't do the full length baffle was that per Reace? The metal piece I assume was installed by ETI during build and I assume it takes the place of the baffle?
I sure hope you get good results and thanks for taking the time to document your work
Dave
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07-09-2015, 08:06 AM
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#186
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,268
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All this talk about prior Domestics operating better than current models leads me to believe the real culprit is global warming........... ?
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
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07-09-2015, 08:42 AM
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#187
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico
Trailer: 2013 Escape 19
Posts: 247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbaglo
If you read all the fridge posts ( and unfortunately, I have, even though I have a 5.0 cu. ft. fridge ) you will find that Reace discussed the situation with Norcold, the other major fridge builder, and was told he could not expect better performance.
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I think it is worth noting that both manufractures make models that work very well. The problem is finding one that will both work well and fit thru the 22" door.
Dave
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07-09-2015, 10:19 AM
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#188
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Site Team
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Canyon Lake, Texas
Trailer: 2015 19 "Past Tents", 2021 F150 Lariat 2.7L EB
Posts: 10,222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave1
I think it is worth noting that both manufractures make models that work very well. The problem is finding one that will both work well and fit thru the 22" door.
Dave
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True, but it still begs the question as to why Dometic and other manufacturers offer a tropical performance rated fridge in markets like Australia and Asia, but refuse to do so in North America. The RM8555 and the RM8551 both have tropical rated 'versions', with similar exterior dimensions to our SN rated fridges.
__________________
"You can't buy happiness, but you can buy an RV. And that is pretty close."
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07-09-2015, 11:40 AM
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#189
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: North Van., British Columbia
Trailer: 2014 Escape 19, sold; 2019 Escape 21, Sept. 2019
Posts: 8,728
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patandlinda
Thanks Ron for info . You are right I found that extension pipe (tomorrow will put it on thread ) in Australia , not here . I don't know about this metal on back of my frig , but Reace
was adamant I put it back , so I did . I think I can get it off if I need to without pulling frig . Do you have figures for your outside temps on your trip ? Very interested what you were dealing with . Pat
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The Australia folks did finally respond but it was about a month later. By that time I'd already done my mod. It still would have been my first choice.
I didn't have any temperatures over the mid 80's but it was warm enough for me. As I mentioned, we had frozen food for 42 days and never had to change the setting of 3 bars. So it did the job for me. Don't know what it would do in 100 degree situations. Don't want to find out.
Ron
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07-09-2015, 11:45 AM
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#190
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: North Van., British Columbia
Trailer: 2014 Escape 19, sold; 2019 Escape 21, Sept. 2019
Posts: 8,728
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zardoz
Wow, nice work Ron. Were you a Tin Knocker in a previous life?
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No, but over the years I've gradually gone from having an all woodwork shop at home to also having a full metal shop. I like building things. By the time I'd finished this car I'd also become quite comfortable working with aluminum.
Ron
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07-09-2015, 11:47 AM
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#191
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2013
Location: ..., New Mexico
Trailer: 2013 Esc19/'14 Silvrado
Posts: 4,193
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Welcome back, Ron. So it's true the perma-frost has stopped melting?
I was going to duplicate your baffle design using aluminum and rivets but just learned about welding rods that repairs aluminum using a propane torch. Any experience or opinion on that?
__________________
Myron
"A billion here, a billion there...add it all up and before you know it you're talking real money." Everett Dirkson
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07-09-2015, 12:41 PM
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#192
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: North Van., British Columbia
Trailer: 2014 Escape 19, sold; 2019 Escape 21, Sept. 2019
Posts: 8,728
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MyronL
Welcome back, Ron. So it's true the perma-frost has stopped melting?
I was going to duplicate your baffle design using aluminum and rivets but just learned about welding rods that repairs aluminum using a propane torch. Any experience or opinion on that?
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Don't think the perma frost has stopped melting and my burning 378 gal. of gas probably didn't help. Some random sections of road seem to be hugely affected by permafrost, it looks like those sections have a chronic problem. It looks like they have to do major work on a yearly basis to keep them passable.
I have a TIG welder so I've never tried the propane aluminum welding method but I've seen the videos and it seems to work.
My baffles are in two pieces. They overlap so making them fit the space exactly wasn't difficult. I think that it's just as easy to use pop rivets or screws.
Ron
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07-09-2015, 01:12 PM
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#193
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Yellow Springs, Ohio
Trailer: 2013 Escape 19
Posts: 709
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Some time time last year in one of the earlier threads about the 6.7 cu ft fridge, I suggested that people actually take their Escapes in for warranty service on their fridge. Few did; however, it netted me an entirely new cooling loop and aftermarket fan, all covered under warranty. As it turns out, this still didn't look like it was good enough so I was fortunate enough to get a replacement (now on the way from Dometic). My point is, that many of us love to work on these problems and share our complaints and proposed solutions, but until more of these problem fridges show up at RV centers for warranty repair, Dometic can claim total ignorance of the problem. They do not read all the forum discussions....they're busy marketing their less than adequate fridges. So all the owners continue to complain and/or tinker on their own. I'm one of those also, but I still think it's worth taking these things in for warranty service to see what can be done and go on record as being unhappy with their product.
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07-09-2015, 02:39 PM
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#194
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Marana, Arizona
Trailer: 2018 Airstream Flying Cloud (Escape 19 & 5.0 previously)
Posts: 1,078
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parker
Some time time last year in one of the earlier threads about the 6.7 cu ft fridge, I suggested that people actually take their Escapes in for warranty service on their fridge. Few did; however, it netted me an entirely new cooling loop and aftermarket fan, all covered under warranty. As it turns out, this still didn't look like it was good enough so I was fortunate enough to get a replacement (now on the way from Dometic). My point is, that many of us love to work on these problems and share our complaints and proposed solutions, but until more of these problem fridges show up at RV centers for warranty repair, Dometic can claim total ignorance of the problem. They do not read all the forum discussions....they're busy marketing their less than adequate fridges. So all the owners continue to complain and/or tinker on their own. I'm one of those also, but I still think it's worth taking these things in for warranty service to see what can be done and go on record as being unhappy with their product.
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I agree that without the consumer properly documenting their issues with Dometc, the company will always have plausible deniability. But I find it hard to imagine that they are so cavalier about the quality and performance of their products as to put a genuinely inferior product into the marketplace. They are a huge global company; I can only imagine how big their R&D department is and how extensive they test their products. As for tracking the several RV and Marine forums where their products are discussed, they'd be crazy not to track every word written (great job for an intern). With some of the feedback coming in on this thread showing positive results with the modifications made, HIGHLY UNSCIENTIFIC data I should note, maybe the issue is how these fridge's are installed. Like Tom ("Kountrykamper") pointed out earlier, none of us can point to one single thing that "cured" our problems, but combined, we've gotten pretty good results.
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07-09-2015, 03:01 PM
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#195
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Site Team
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Canyon Lake, Texas
Trailer: 2015 19 "Past Tents", 2021 F150 Lariat 2.7L EB
Posts: 10,222
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Dometic RM8551 insuffucent cooling
Or, they could simply allow the sale of their high performance fridges in North America. This is a much larger market than the ones they sell the high performance fridges in, and for the life of me I can't understand why they don't do it. I guess there's an aversion to profits.
__________________
"You can't buy happiness, but you can buy an RV. And that is pretty close."
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07-09-2015, 03:07 PM
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#196
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: North Vancouver, British Columbia
Trailer: 2009 Escape 17B 2020 Toyota Highlander XLE
Posts: 17,136
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Maybe you could ask Toyota?
__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
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07-09-2015, 09:27 PM
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#197
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Ventura County, California
Trailer: 2013 19 Escape
Posts: 7,203
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave1
Pat,
That is one of the nicest insulation jobs I've ever seen! A couple questions, I see you didn't do the full length baffle was that per Reace? The metal piece I assume was installed by ETI during build and I assume it takes the place of the baffle?
I sure hope you get good results and thanks for taking the time to document your work
Dave
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Hi Dave . Thankyou for the nice compliment. Reace before did the reworked baffle and it didn't work , not like what Ron or others have done . However I found where the baffle I had was only at a 15 degree . Tom did a smoke test and found it needed to be 45 degrees . I also found lots from Dometic showing the 45 degree where you have a bigger clearance at back like we have . With a straight wall clearance should be no more then 1 in . Well we all have more due to curve walls etc. The brown piece Escape put on I think acts as a heat sink . I think , I hope with now my fans running I can get the heat out of there to roof. As for the insulation box I made for frig , every Dometic manual I found and the 2 previous Dometics I had all around frig it needs to be insulated . That was why I went to make my walls thicker , like a cooler . That was something that bothered me a year ago so I finally got that accomplished now . I wish I could have gotten the pipe extensions I found but no luck . I will post that information on this thread .Now for my trip soon will give this a try . Pat
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07-09-2015, 09:30 PM
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#198
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Ventura County, California
Trailer: 2013 19 Escape
Posts: 7,203
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron in BC
Don't think the perma frost has stopped melting and my burning 378 gal. of gas probably didn't help. Some random sections of road seem to be hugely affected by permafrost, it looks like those sections have a chronic problem. It looks like they have to do major work on a yearly basis to keep them passable.
I have a TIG welder so I've never tried the propane aluminum welding method but I've seen the videos and it seems to work.
My baffles are in two pieces. They overlap so making them fit the space exactly wasn't difficult. I think that it's just as easy to use pop rivets or screws.
Ron
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Really like the baffle you did . I think it is better then wood . Hope my idea's help me and if I can get a couple more degrees out of this I will call it a day . Pat
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07-10-2015, 06:09 PM
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#199
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Ventura County, California
Trailer: 2013 19 Escape
Posts: 7,203
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dometic RM8551 insufficent cooling
Finished up today . All systems work . Fans , electrical , gas , 12 volt . Sealed up back of frig at bottom . Now we will see . I want to thank Tom (Kountry Kamper ) Rich (Zardoz) for taking your time and trying to guide me along . Sorry my scans are so small will try again . If all else fails always have my Penguin cooler along . Pat
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07-10-2015, 06:11 PM
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#200
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,268
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I like that security bar across the microwave, are you planning one for the refer?
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
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