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Old 03-25-2023, 04:34 PM   #1
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Lithium conversion in 2018 Escape 19

I am converting to Lithium batteries in my 2018 E19 (2 SOK 100AH) and am looking for some input from other 19 owners who have done the same. I will be leaving the batteries in the front storage box. Will be replacing the WFCO 8955 converter with their new "auto detect" converter board that has the Lithium charge algorithm. Also adding a Victron DC-DC charger and replacing the existing terminal-mounted fuse for my 2000 watt inverter feed with a T-spec fuse. So,couple of questions... where have folks mounted the DC-DC charger? The T fuse? Hoping to put both in the storage box to avoid too much new wiring into the trailer body. Any and all tips appreciated!
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Old 03-25-2023, 04:46 PM   #2
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We added solar and converted to LiFePO4 battery. See:
https://www.escapeforum.org/forums/f...tml#post426495

We also wanted to minimize wire lengths and loss of storage. Under the driver side bench is a DC-DC converter, solar controller, 100 A-hr battery. shut-off switches for battery and solar panel feed, and all fuses. We did not have the need for an inverter.

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Old 03-25-2023, 05:20 PM   #3
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Thanks! I want to leave the batteries in the storage box as I already have 4/0 cable from there into the trailer for my inverter. Really don't want to mess with that wiring again.

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We added solar and converted to LiFePO4 battery. See:
https://www.escapeforum.org/forums/f...tml#post426495

We also wanted to minimize wire lengths and loss of storage. Under the driver side bench is a DC-DC converter, solar controller, 100 A-hr battery. shut-off switches for battery and solar panel feed, and all fuses. We did not have the need for an inverter.

2 cents
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Old 03-27-2023, 04:33 PM   #4
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When it comes from the factory here's where it's located, at least in my 2021 E19. Mine originally came with a Victron, but the current was more than my truck wiring was rated for and so I swapped it out for the Renogy. It would have been nice if I could have reduced the Victron current draw, but alas the Smart charger wasn't that smart.
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Old 03-27-2023, 05:31 PM   #5
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When it comes from the factory here's where it's located, at least in my 2021 E19. Mine originally came with a Victron, but the current was more than my truck wiring was rated for and so I swapped it out for the Renogy. It would have been nice if I could have reduced the Victron current draw, but alas the Smart charger wasn't that smart.
On the advice of another forum member, I installed a simple Victron DC-DC converter and a 9 amp max output, hence, the converter limits the current draw from the truck to a "reasonable" level.
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Old 03-28-2023, 07:58 AM   #6
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Thanks for that! Looks like the factory setup pretty much fills that under-bench space. I'm going to try to put my dc-dc in the front storage box. Hoping the 18 amp Victron doesn't overstress my alternator!


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Originally Posted by alanerickson View Post
When it comes from the factory here's where it's located, at least in my 2021 E19. Mine originally came with a Victron, but the current was more than my truck wiring was rated for and so I swapped it out for the Renogy. It would have been nice if I could have reduced the Victron current draw, but alas the Smart charger wasn't that smart.
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Old 08-08-2023, 08:11 PM   #7
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Lithium conversion budget plans

I have a 2019 17B with factory 190W panel, Renogy mppt charge controller (it has a lithium setting) and battery monitor, original Interstate 6V LA batteries. No inverter, WF8955pec converter.

My LA batteries will need to be replaced next season. I could just buy two new Interstate batteries.

Or …….200 Ahrs of lithium, a new converter, a dc to dc charger,

Can those that have gone down this path already recommend any particular models of these units ? A dealer to purchase from ?

Do I need an isolated dc to dc charger ? Or non isolated ?

I’m thinking a 18 or 20 A dc to dc charger ? I have a pickup truck with a 170 A alternator, right now if my batteries are down I get 25A in the RV right after the engine starts, it gradually goes down as the batteries accept less. The battery charge wire is fused at 40 A under the hood.

Looking at the Victron Energy Orion-Tr Smart 12/12-Volt 18 amp 220-Watt DC-DC Charger, Isolated (Bluetooth)

I’ve read all the threads on lithium conversions I think. Is there anything you would do differently ?

Any suggestions appreciated.

Bob
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Old 08-08-2023, 09:59 PM   #8
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One consideration is that your two 6V Pb acid batteries are most likely about 215 Ahr. Since the lowest discharge typically recommended is 50% for Pb acid, that means you have about 100 Ahr usable battery storage. Since some LiFePO4 batteries allow for 100% discharge, I would design for a single 100 Ahr Li battery, not two.

For a 190W panel, 100 Ahr of battery storage is a reasonable design criteria.
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Old 08-09-2023, 10:40 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lanark Camper View Post
I have a 2019 17B with factory 190W panel, Renogy mppt charge controller (it has a lithium setting) and battery monitor, original Interstate 6V LA batteries. No inverter, WF8955pec converter.

My LA batteries will need to be replaced next season. I could just buy two new Interstate batteries.

Or …….200 Ahrs of lithium, a new converter, a dc to dc charger,

Can those that have gone down this path already recommend any particular models of these units ? A dealer to purchase from ?

Do I need an isolated dc to dc charger ? Or non isolated ?

I’m thinking a 18 or 20 A dc to dc charger ? I have a pickup truck with a 170 A alternator, right now if my batteries are down I get 25A in the RV right after the engine starts, it gradually goes down as the batteries accept less. The battery charge wire is fused at 40 A under the hood.

Looking at the Victron Energy Orion-Tr Smart 12/12-Volt 18 amp 220-Watt DC-DC Charger, Isolated (Bluetooth)

I’ve read all the threads on lithium conversions I think. Is there anything you would do differently ?

Any suggestions appreciated.
Bob
Bob: I can highly recommend the Bestgo batteries from Electric Car Parts. Many have also been happy with SOK that are built very similarly. Of course there is also Battle Born. I would go with 200AH as you suggest because you may be boondocking on some cloudy days or under tree cover where solar is not very effective. We have 400AH but I also have a high demand with 9,000 BTU mini-split A/C run off inverter overnight.
https://www.electriccarpartscompany....-battery-packs

Because you have a common frame ground for the trailer and tow vehicle you can use a non-isolated Victron. I mistakenly bought an isolated Victron Orion (more $$) and when it was wired up I had lost trailer lighting and electric brakes. I ended up bridging the grounds so essentially making it non-isolated. We have the 12/12-18 and I saw 17A on the Victron recently with the tow vehicle idling. The 7-pin plug gets quite warm at the +12V charge pin. Not sure if that is normal or not. The umbilical charge wire is only 10 AWG so that could be part of the problem. Large gauge dedicated wiring the length of the tow vehicle and into the trailer with its own plug at the hitch is really the ideal way to go.
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Old 08-09-2023, 11:51 AM   #10
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It is worth checking the input current to a DC to DC converter - it can be higher than expected. I replaced a Victron 12/12- 30 because it melted pin 4 of the 7 pin trailer connector. The replacement 12/12 - 18 was still a problem. It drew enough input current to blow the 25 amp fuse on my 2018 F150 trailer charge line multiple times. This was charging 3 100 amp hour Battleborn lithium batteries.

I finally dug out the 12/12 - 9 that I used with my 17 and have not had problems. The 12/12 - 9 is not Bluetooth, and does not provide staged charging - only a set voltage, so I have to use a clamp on amp meter to make current measurements. So far the input has always been under 25 amps. Anyone wants a good deal on either of the replaced DC to DC converters, see me at the Algonac or Niagara Wine Escape rallies!
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Old 08-09-2023, 12:03 PM   #11
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I shut my DC-DC off, my solar is plenty sufficient to keep my batteries fully charged. I have 412AH of lithium and 350W of solar.
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Old 08-09-2023, 12:25 PM   #12
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As expected all good advice.
I thought the increased capacity of two batteries would be a worthwhile upgrade. We have run down our batteries a couple of times with the furnace. I think it’s good to buy the two batteries together, or one big battery.

I’ll investigate the Bestgo batteries, thanks. Also the explanation on the isolated dc-dc charger

Jon I’ll pm you about the dc-dc charger !

Bob
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Old 08-09-2023, 12:44 PM   #13
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As expected all good advice.
I thought the increased capacity of two batteries would be a worthwhile upgrade. We have run down our batteries a couple of times with the furnace. I think it’s good to buy the two batteries together, or one big battery.

I’ll investigate the Bestgo batteries, thanks. Also the explanation on the isolated dc-dc charger

Jon I’ll pm you about the dc-dc charger !

Bob
If you go with one big battery and have an inverter, be sure to check the maximum output of the battery BMS. Many are limited to 100 amps. By going to 2 100 amp hour batteries you will have 200 amps output while a single battery might limit you to 100; not enough for many inverters.
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Old 08-09-2023, 01:16 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Vermilye View Post
If you go with one big battery and have an inverter, be sure to check the maximum output of the battery BMS. Many are limited to 100 amps. By going to 2 100 amp hour batteries you will have 200 amps output while a single battery might limit you to 100; not enough for many inverters.
To Jon's point take a close look at the specs. The 206AH SOK battery is limited to 100A continuous discharge current. Their larger 280AH battery is rated for 200A continuous. They allow higher peaks but only for a few seconds. The Bestgo 200AH battery is rated for 150A continuous but can handle up to 200A for up to 30 minutes. My 400AH Bestgo can handle 200A for up to 60 minutes. Large inverter draws are not typically going to be sustained for long enough to bother the Bestgo's (or larger SOK battery).
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Old 08-09-2023, 02:43 PM   #15
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Import considerations. We don’t have an inverter that would be a consideration for the battery size. Occasionally use a small one to power the TV. Don’t have a microwave, toaster, etc.

Any suggestions on a new converter ?

Is there any reason it couldn’t be replaced with a good battery charger ?

Bob
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Old 08-09-2023, 04:30 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vermilye View Post
It is worth checking the input current to a DC to DC converter - it can be higher than expected. I replaced a Victron 12/12- 30 because it melted pin 4 of the 7 pin trailer connector. The replacement 12/12 - 18 was still a problem. It drew enough input current to blow the 25 amp fuse on my 2018 F150 trailer charge line multiple times. This was charging 3 100 amp hour Battleborn lithium batteries.
I experienced the same problems as Jon when I installed three Renogy 100AH Lithium batteries and a Redarc 25A DC-DC converter. The 7-pin trailer connector got quite warm, but has not yet melted. I am drawing over 35 amps from the truck when the batteries are low.

The DC-DC converter steps up the voltage to approximately 14V to properly charge Lithium batteries. This creates an equivalent increase in amps drawn from the tow vehicle; 25A out at 14V equals 30A in at 12V, or 35A in at 10V due to voltage drop in the charge line.

The typical RV 7-pin connector is rated at 30 amps, which reduces as the connector ages and corrodes. It is possible to replace these connectors with commercial grade connectors used on semi trucks that are rated at 40 amps continuous. While these connectors will fit most RV mounting points, they are not compatible with RV connectors because the contacts are round instead of flat like an RV connector. The commercial connectors have brass contacts which are much more corrosion resistant than the plated steel contacts in RV connectors.

I will be changing my connectors to the commercial grade items below when my stock RV connector eventually fails.

Commercial grade plug: https://www.waytekwire.com/product/p...n-trailer-plug
Commercial grade socket: https://www.waytekwire.com/product/p...n-trailer-plug
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Old 08-09-2023, 05:36 PM   #17
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Thanks for the info but both of your links go to the plug. Can you provide the link to the proper socket?
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Old 08-09-2023, 06:21 PM   #18
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Thanks for the info but both of your links go to the plug. Can you provide the link to the proper socket?
Oops! My mistake.

Commercial 7-way socket: https://www.waytekwire.com/product/p...nnector-socket
Commercial 7-way plug: https://www.waytekwire.com/product/p...n-trailer-plug
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Old 08-09-2023, 09:59 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Vermilye View Post
If you go with one big battery and have an inverter, be sure to check the maximum output of the battery BMS. Many are limited to 100 amps. By going to 2 100 amp hour batteries you will have 200 amps output while a single battery might limit you to 100; not enough for many inverters.
also the max charge rate. my SOK Batteries have a sustained 100A output, and max 50A charge rate, and recommended 30A charge rate (I think?). so I have two in parallel, so I can pull 200A and charge at over 50A. I opted to get the 206AH batts as they were not twice the price of the 100Ah, and barely bigger than the original golf cart bats... this gives me 412AH or 5260 watt*hours of power, which will last me well over a week of dry camping without any sun. my 350W solar panel will fully charge a completely run down battery with less than 2 days of good sunshine.

I chose SOK because I saw several youtubers take them apart and I was impressed with their metal cases and how nicely put together they were and how they actually tested to at least the rated specs without any gotchas. CurrentConnected is a stocking US distributor, in Las Vegas, NV, which isn't *that* far shipping wise from my central left coast home. I got my batteries in days from ordering..

I did my upgrade incrementally. I installed the PD4655L first, and got it working with my existing GC-2's, I already had a SmartShunt so I could monitor everything was working. Then I installed the Victron MPPT 100/30 solar controller with the original 160W solar panel, and again got it working, and yes, MPPT gives you more power from a panel than PWM. I forget which order I installed the 350W solar panel or the Lithium batteries, but again, I got each stage functioning before I continued. There's a thread here somewhere where I documented this whole process in some detail.
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Old 08-09-2023, 10:35 PM   #20
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We are considering this upgrade to our 2017 E19 and are wondering budget. I'm thinking $3500? We have added solar and have a solar controller that can be set to lithium batteries so I think I'm looking at the batteries, the charger, and other components to integrate them into the trailer. Thanks!

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