How much turning space needed to park a 5.0TA?

[AuthorSP]

Hello! As we sit through our long, long wait for our future 5.0TA, we're planning for various things, including a garage to store her for the winter. What follows is my attempt to give a visual idea of the plan, so as to imagine the process for getting into the garage with enough space. I know this is an odd question, but I'm hoping some folks here have done this sort of thing, and any help is appreciated!

In the space we are considering, the layout of the garage will probably have to be perpendicular to the road (so if road is east-west, then the building runs north-south, and the camper will face east-west inside the garage). The building is to the north of the road. The entry to the garage will be on the west side. The approach to the property is from the east. The idea is to have doors on both sides of the garage so we can simply drive in and pull through.

So that means we will have to pass the garage, then turn right off the road onto the driveway, then turn to the right again in order to enter the garage.

So this is the part I am not sure of. Roughly speaking, how tight can we make the two right turns without being difficult to navigate? How much of a "straightaway" do we need before the doors in order to drive straight in? Any other considerations?
The property is not cleared yet, so this is to plan for the driveway and position of the garage in relation to the road, hopefully with as little space required as is reasonably possible. (Sketch below on #9.)
Thanks!

[Chamberman]

Originally Posted by AuthorSP

Hello! As we sit through our long, long wait for our future 5.0TA, we're planning for various things, including a garage to store her for the winter. What follows is my attempt to give a visual idea of the plan, so as to imagine the process for getting into the garage with enough space. I know this is an odd question, but I'm hoping some folks here have done this sort of thing, and any help is appreciated!

In the space we are considering, the layout of the garage will probably have to be perpendicular to the road (so if road is east-west, then the building runs north-south, and the camper will face east-west inside the garage). The building is to the north of the road. The entry to the garage will be on the west side. The approach to the property is from the east. The idea is to have doors on both sides of the garage so we can simply drive in and pull through.

So that means we will have to pass the garage, then turn right off the road onto the driveway, then turn to the right again in order to enter the garage.

So this is the part I am not sure of. Roughly speaking, how tight can we make the two right turns without being difficult to navigate? How much of a "straightaway" do we need before the doors in order to drive straight in? Any other considerations?
Thanks!

You probably want to put together a basic drawing including measurements to give people a better idea of what you're working with. For instance when you say "pass the garage and turn right, then turn right again" What are the spaces you're dealing with? Do you have an 8, 9, 10, 12ft driveway width? How far once you turn right the first time do you go before turning right again? Are there any items in the way, a tree or power pole, etc?

There's a lot to be taken into account.

FWIW I to am in the same boat as you, we're waiting for a 5.0 too so I cannot answer your question even with a drawing. However I can see how hard it would be for a current owner that doesn't know your situation to come up with an answer for you without a drawing to visualize it.

[azjack]

Before we committed to our 5.0 we took the pickup and a tape measure and as son drove the RAM I measured the space available behind the vehicle. Every vehicle may vary as to how sharp it will turn and the available space is constant. We determined I would be able to turn the vehicle and trailer around to position the trailer properly under the carport.
AZjack

[AuthorSP]

That could be a good option to try, thanks.

[AuthorSP]

Originally Posted by Chamberman

You probably want to put together a basic drawing including measurements to give people a better idea of what you're working with. For instance when you say "pass the garage and turn right, then turn right again" What are the spaces you're dealing with? Do you have an 8, 9, 10, 12ft driveway width? How far once you turn right the first time do you go before turning right again? Are there any items in the way, a tree or power pole, etc?

Right now there aren't any details like those, because the piece of property is not cleared, so it's an open slate. I'm hoping to use as little space as is reasonable needed for the driveway I will have to create, though.

[gbaglo]

Why "drive thru"?

[UncleTim]

Originally Posted by AuthorSP

Right now there aren't any details like those, because the piece of property is not cleared, so it's an open slate. I'm hoping to use as little space as is reasonable needed for the driveway I will have to create, though.

Then do a rough sketch. Give us an easy way to understand your questions. Right now I cannot do that because I do not understand the question. And I am a landscape architect and a 5.0 owner.

Let's start the conversation this way. If you are not backing up and are only pulling thru, then my rule of thumb (watch out) is anything I can drive thru, I can get the trailer thru. MOSTLY, give a little lea-way here! There are small differences and they can get you, like turning radius, not to mention height.

If you are backing up, then all bets are off. The 5.0 pivots at the axel, not the bumper. That means it is much slower to initiate a turn. Much slower.

I also drive a 12 foot flatbed trailer for my whitewater boat. No comparison.

Look at the enclosed image. I have to back up the 5.0 in this mess. And most of my neighbors own more cars than they can park in the street. This place is nuts!

Almost all of my troubles have come from backing into this space. I can flip a u-turn on most streets! True. I have not failed to get in any camp spots yet, even the ones we punted on.

In short, I would give clearances whenever possible. If the turning radius and path are comfortable in your truck, then you may be okay, as long as you can accommodate an additional 17 feet.

But to be sure, consults Google maps or sketch it up, then describe it.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

Why "drive thru"?

My analogous experience is decades and hundreds of instances getting loaded hay-trailers into barns, both bumper-pull similar in LxWxH to an E21 and goosenecks similar in size to the E5.0.

• A barn with a drive-through aisle is absolutely quicker and easier to enter
• A barn with a dead-end aisle requires more room to maneuver outside of the entry (a 'backing tee', or similar space; and don't forget the 'swing-space' for the nose of the tow vehicle if the dead-end leg of the 'tee' is perpendicular to the entry)

IME even the most skilled and seasoned driver will 'pass' on an 'opportunity' to back a trailer if given a ready alternative. Yep, either can serve just fine, but if given a site where either can be accommodated and integrated with everything else equally well, I'd go with the drive-through.

YMMV.

[AuthorSP]

Ok, here is the proposed sketch. Since the land is not cleared, I am looking for the minimum and optimum distances from the road and angles. More or less. Not an expert in this, just trying to figure out how much land I need to clear east to west. Thanks!

[Centex]

Originally Posted by AuthorSP

Ok, here is the proposed sketch.

Suggest you envision the curves as longer-radius 'sweeps' rather than short-radius 'elbows' (sorry, no specific dimension suggestions).

Does the future site development include on-site parking for the TV, other vehicles, or other structures? If yes, then variations of the 'Tee' with back-in trailer parking my be the better choice in the long run.

[gbaglo]

Originally Posted by AuthorSP

I am looking for the minimum and optimum distances from the road and angles.

If the garage is not already built, position it at 45 degrees to the angle shown in your sketch ( 90 degrees ), depending how you want to enter the drive way. You drive in forward, past the garage and then reverse into the garage.

[AuthorSP]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

If the garage is not already built, position it at 45 degrees to the angle shown in your sketch ( 90 degrees ), depending how you want to enter the drive way. You drive in forward, past the garage and then reverse into the garage.

Sorry, we're planning on a pull through option.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

If the garage is not already built, position it at 45 degrees to the angle shown in your sketch, depending how you want to enter the drive way. You drive in forward, past the garage and then reverse into the garage.

Sketch, please .... if I understand your suggestion correctly the angled garage, depending on direction, works for you when entering and against you when exiting or vice-versa?

EDIT - nevermind, given above post it's moot for the OP's purposes, no need to pursue that

[AuthorSP]

Originally Posted by Centex

Suggest you envision the curves as longer-radius 'sweeps' rather than short-radius 'elbows' (sorry, no specific dimension suggestions).

Does the future site development include on-site parking for the TV, other vehicles, or other structures? If yes, then variations of the 'Tee' with back-in trailer parking my be the better choice in the long run.

Yes, I can't draw sweeps with this program, which is part of the reason I'm trying to find out the best amount of space east-west that I have to clear to create the pull through for the trailer. I'm not sure why a back up solution would be better in the long run if I have space to make what is essentially a semi-circular drive with a garage at the apex.

[UncleTim]

So here is an idea. I would have a place to park it outside.

The red area suggests an area you could use to park it. Just a thought. You could put this area wherever it suits you.

The red radius is also something to consider. That will make it generous to turn the trailer.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by AuthorSP

.... I'm not sure why a back up solution would be better in the long run if I have space to make what is essentially a semi-circular drive with a garage at the apex.

Gotchya on the graphics, no worries.

IMO the only reason a 'Tee' might be better in the long run (in terms of net clearing / tree removal / screening, gates, cuts, and culverts at the frontage road) is if future development requires other driving / parking access anywhere beyond the indicated semi-circular drive in any direction (as soon as you add an extension to that, you've got 2/3 of a 'Tee' at one end or the other of the trailer garage).

Sorry, I'm thinking as I do for myself, and I do realize you are not me ! I'm on 11 rural acres and strive to maintain as much uninterrupted buffer as possible between the interior of my property and the public frontage road. I have a single public road access / entry gate with a 'full-loop drive' inside that wooded buffer along the frontage (minimal sight-line from the public road into the property). But yeah, that takes area (and future interests) you might not have.

I do remember the agonies of site planning and clearing for my occupancy 35+ years ago when my land was 'virgin' ... so you have my empathy and best wishes. Try to imagine the distant future, and Have Fun!

[AuthorSP]

Originally Posted by UncleTim

So here is an idea. I would have a place to park it outside.

The red area suggests an area you could use to park it. Just a thought. You could put this area wherever it suits you.

The red radius is also something to consider. That will make it generous to turn the trailer.

Parking it outside is obviously an easier approach than making a garage and driveway, but with Maine winters, that is not what I want, hence this project to create a plan for a drive and garage.

I have enough space to create a semicircular drive with a garage at the apex. But I don't want to clear more than I have to, so I am trying to determine how much space I really need to make a those turns. The drawing is by no means to scale, just a general idea of what I am trying to accomplish. Those two bends are going to be less sharp, I just don't know how sharp they have to be.

My thought is that I would need at least the length of the TV and trailer, minimum, for the driveway before the door. I think I would need more, realistically.

Centex, yes, I am trying to figure out the least amount of space to clear to the north. East to west is not as much a problem, but I want to clear the least amount that way, too.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by AuthorSP

.... My thought is that I would need at least the length of the TV and trailer, minimum, for the driveway before the door. I think I would need more, realistically.

Methinks you can get by with a lot less 'straight run' if willing / able to add a bit of width to the entry/exit doors and not constrict yourself to a constant-width drive in the arc of the curves. There's lots of variables that can be juggled to achieve the least-compromised / most suitable solution depending on your objectives. Try to not get wrapped-up in rectilinear and / or symmetrical 'boxes' (referring to both physical layout and thought ).

Hopefully all of this doesn't need to actually happen before you have your trailer. TIP - take your rig, a partner, and a 100' tape to a still damp parking lot after a rain - drive in various arcs and see / measure what your truck and trailer tire-paths look like.

[HarleyD]

Originally Posted by UncleTim

Then do a rough sketch.
If you are backing up, then all bets are off. The 5.0 pivots at the axel, not the bumper. That means it is much slower to initiate a turn. Much slower."

I totally agree with Uncle Tim the backing in a turn initiation is much slower and for the his reasoning. But, the amount of turn increases quickly as you travel back due to the hitch being pushed away from the trailer track and not following the trailer track. So, the "catching" of the turning trailer much initiate almost immediately. It can not happen 1/2 way through the backing process like a bumper pull it must be an integral part of the initiation.

But that is not the question here. Turning radii of various truck can vary drastically. The radius of the turn going forward with a 5th wheel is dictated by the max turning radius of the truck. it is much less than the available turning while backing.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by HarleyD

The radius of the turn going forward with a 5th wheel is dictated by the max turning radius of the truck. it is much less than the available turning while backing.

Yes, but the turning radius which can be sustained, without jamming into a jackknife, is the same in reverse as in forward. And since none of us can perfectly catch an deviation, it isn't practical to continue a turn in reverse as tight as the tightest possible turn moving forward, so it wouldn't be wise to plan to need that tight in reverse.