New inverter

[gbaglo]

Batteries develop sulfation each time they are used (discharged - recharged). If they are overcharged or undercharged or left discharged, some for even just several days, they will rapidly develop sulfate. Even when a battery is stored fully charged, sulfate will form unless a desulfating battery charger is used. ( of course they sell these )


Avoid Battery Sulfation - BatteryMINDers

[richm]

Originally Posted by Walkabout

I use a CPAP at night and need AC power for that....

My Resmed Airsense 10 CPAP consumes 4.5A when powered by a Resmed DC-DC adapter. It can be configured to shut off both the humidifier and heated tubing, and then consumes around 2.5A.

[gbaglo]

My oxygen concentrator keeps the room at 72F in the dead of winter.

[Rossue]

Originally Posted by Walkabout

I just took possession of a 21C, and I want to install an inverter and new batteries. I know they come with a Go Power inverter. Is this the best one for the job and is it big enough? 1500w vs 2000w. I will probably use the 2 6v batteries, due to money restraints.
Thanks,

Inevitably this thread will advise you to just bite the bullet & go Lithium. Or- you can just cruise over to Costco and get a pair of Interstate GC2 batts for about $200. Inverter- yeah would agree a 2000 W Pure Sine Wave is probably best.

[oldwave]

Highly recommend the cost effective Progressive dynamics inverters with built in transfer switch.

[Walkabout]

Thank you, that's helpful

[Jane P.]

Originally Posted by Walkabout

I just took possession of a 21C, and I want to install an inverter and new batteries. I know they come with a Go Power inverter. Is this the best one for the job and is it big enough? 1500w vs 2000w. I will probably use the 2 6v batteries, due to money restraints.
Thanks,

Congratulations on your “new” trailer. Use it in the best of health!

Firstly, Check out this web page regarding inverter sizes and recommendations.

https://www.mobile-solarpower.com/inverters.html

Your 1500w inverter will power most AC appliances. While off grid, you well may yearn for an appliance that is too powerful for your Go Power. But it’s best to get some actual camping experience to see how well the 1500W meets your needs.

My advice: go camping with the 1500w. Hold off on upgrading until you get a feeling for your power needs/preferences. Accordingly, if the 6 V batteries on your trailer are in good condition, stay with them.

Personally, I’d be more more inclined to invest in a second solar panel.

Now, for your off grid CPAP needs:
You do not need an inverter for your CPAP. I have a CPAP & have been dry camping for years without an inverter. What you do need is a 12 volt adopter made for the CPAP, and a 12 volt (cigarette lighter) outlet by your bed. You’ll be better off running the CPAP on 12 volts. Leave the CPAP’s humidifier at home as it consumes too much power.

Because you have a CPAP, go with the lithiums when you are ready to replace the lead acids. The difference in efficiency between lithium & lead acid is amazing. You can go for longer periods of time, using a full compliment of 12 volt appliances (heater, ceiling fan & stereo) before needing to recharge. If you continue to boon-dock for most of your trips, lithium is definitely worth the extra expense.

If/when you decide to get a larger inverter, here are some things to consider:

• Spacial requirements: you’ll probably want to place it in the same place as the Go Power. Inverters require 6" space fore & aft for airflow.
• Compatible with life pro batteries
• Full safety protection features: It has low voltage protection, over-voltage, overload, and short circuit protection.
• Get one with Remote Control so you can turn it off when hooking up

I am planning to get a inverter. These are my top picks. These are large in size and require 6” of open space on the input & output sides for ventilation.

Giandel 2200W (latest model)
15.7 x 9 x 3.5 inches

GoWISE Power 2000W
17.1 x 9.3 x 4 inches

RICH SOLAR 2000W
11 x 5.5 x 2.87 inches

I really like the Giandel. It has a great reputation, and the manufacturer stands behind it’s products.

The Rich Solar unit is the same, exact product as the Renogy 2000W inverter that John in Santa Cruz owns. But I prefer Rich Solar’s customer service. This is not my first choice, but it is relatively compact.

Hope this helps.

[hugh]

By the time you've bought the inverter, high current cables, transfer switch, disconnect switch, fuses, etc, the price difference between using a couple of GC-2's and the equivalent lithium battery may not be that significant.
Two GC-2's are around $300, and you could buy a 200Ah lithium battery for around $600. If you're already paying $1000+ for all the other stuff, is the extra $300 a deal breaker?

[Rossue]

Originally Posted by hugh

By the time you've bought the inverter, high current cables, transfer switch, disconnect switch, fuses, etc, the price difference between using a couple of GC-2's and the equivalent lithium battery may not be that significant.
Two GC-2's are around $300, and you could buy a 200Ah lithium battery for around $600. If you're already paying $1000+ for all the other stuff, is the extra $300 a deal breaker?

I don't believe this: if it sounds to good to be true it almost always is. 200AH of a reliable brand of lithium is more like $1,000. And what does the cost of installing an inverter have to do with anything? There isn't just a $300 premium.

Originally Posted by Jane P.

My advice: go camping with the 1500w. Hold off on upgrading until you get a feeling for your power needs/preferences. Accordingly, if the 6 V batteries on your trailer are in good condition, stay with them. Personally, I’d be more more inclined to invest in a second solar panel.

Now, for your off grid CPAP needs:
You do not need an inverter for your CPAP. I have a CPAP & have been dry camping for years without an inverter. What you do need is a 12 volt adopter made for the CPAP, and a 12 volt (cigarette lighter) outlet by your bed. You’ll be better off running the CPAP on 12 volts. Leave the CPAP’s humidifier at home as it consumes too much power.

Because you have a CPAP, go with the lithiums when you are ready to replace the lead acids. The difference in efficiency between lithium & lead acid is amazing. You can go for longer periods of time, using a full compliment of 12 volt appliances (heater, ceiling fan & stereo) before needing to recharge. If you continue to boon-dock for most of your trips, lithium is definitely worth the extra expense.

OP doesn't have the 1500W Inverter or 6V batteries. Re-read his Post #3.

To use lithium a modification or replacement of the WFCO converter will also be needed to properly charge. Then how about over voltage protection for Maxxfan & other items?

Just don't agree with a blanket endorsement of costly DC systems- especially for small trailers such as Escapes as it just isn't needed in most cases. Just because it costs more doesn't automatically make it worth spending the $$$.

[John in Santa Cruz]

indeed. My main reason for the DC system upgrade was switching to a DC only compressor fridge. I wanted to be able to dry camp as long as a week WITHOUT SUN, so sized the system appropriately, my calculations suggested dual 12V 200AH batts would do the trick.. The stock 160W solar panel didn't seem quite up to this workload, so it got replaced with a 360W LGE panel which is working great, but of course, that neccessitated a MPPT solar controller. Other than the DC fridge, we're fairly light users of DC....

.... Butt, since we had so much now, and because my wife's biggest complaint was not having a hair dryer when camping, I added the inverter. She prefers a salon grade hair dryer thats 1850 watts, so I went whole hog and got the 2000W inverter.

With hindsight, I probably could have skipped the converter upgrade and just relied on solar 90% of the time, but there will be that other 10%. and I probably could have skipped the DC-DC converter for tow vehicle charging the trailer, and relied on the solar, but I'm happy its there for an extra charge source during winter trips

[hugh]

Originally Posted by Rossue

I don't believe this: if it sounds to good to be true it almost always is. 200AH of a reliable brand of lithium is more like $1,000. And what does the cost of installing an inverter have to do with anything? There isn't just a $300 premium.

OP doesn't have the 1500W Inverter or 6V batteries. Re-read his Post #3.

I was suggesting that If the OP was going to invest in an expensive upgrade (including the inverter and other equipment he'd mentioned) that the cost difference between the two battery chemistries may not be a significant percentage of the overall cost.


Reliability data on lithium and wet cell batteries is hard to come byy, but even the cheapest prismatic LiFePO4 cells vastly exceed both the durability and reliability of wet cells. So, does it matter that a $1000 battery exceeds the reliability of a $600 battery, if both are a big step up from lead acid?

[fudge_brownie]

Something to add to the formula of inverter. We have a large enough inverter to operate the microwave. We also have dual 6 volt batteries which provide adequate power for the microwave. The formula works for awhile but the 700 watt microwave is a big draw for those batteries. I estimate about seven minutes of microwave time before those dual 6 volt batteries, even fully charged up, are down to 11.7 to 11.8 volts. This on four year old AGM’s. Older batteries means less time.

Cooking a small pack of frozen peas calls for 5 minutes. Have two of them? Sorry, try a sauce pan on the stove. Want to heat some Bob Evans potatoes, get out another sauce pan.

My point is the microwave is great, but small, when on shore power. It can do briefs tasks when on flooded batteries. It can do longer tasks with lithium. But both of the latter two battery systems could leave you in a power shortage under a canopy of trees or cloudy days.

[Jane P.]

Originally Posted by hugh

By the time you've bought the inverter, high current cables, transfer switch, disconnect switch, fuses, etc, the price difference between using a couple of GC-2's and the equivalent lithium battery may not be that significant.
Two GC-2's are around $300, and you could buy a 200Ah lithium battery for around $600. If you're already paying $1000+ for all the other stuff, is the extra $300 a deal breaker?

Your pricing is off for lithium batteries: a 100ah SOK sells for $570. Battleborn recently has raised their prices (inflation strikes again) However you can probably get one for under $900. I give SOK best bang for your buck status.

Walkabout will need two 100ah lithiums or one 200ah. So his lithium purchase now approaches $1200. In addition he’ll need a BVM. A Victron with Bluetooth capabilities, costs approximately $200.

There’s no way to ignore the costs associated with moving to lithium. I am recommending it because the OP has a CPAP machine. I am assuming the he will be camping off grid for the majority of his trips, and be remaining in place for more than 7-10 days.

Because he lives in the US, the OP can locate the lithium batter(ies) in the cabin - a major advantage. This shifts the lead acid battery weight from the tongue to the cabin (lithiums are half the weight of lead acids).

What can he now place alongside his BBQ, power cords and fresh water hoses, in the Escape’s tongue storage box? A inverter backup generator.

Not only can he keep his 1500W inverter, but he can use his microwave all day long and power his CPAP. Even if he’s stuck in the snow or mud under extensive cloud cover for several weeks. Imagine the possibilities!

Just sayin’

[hugh]

Originally Posted by Jane P.

Your pricing is off for lithium batteries: a 100ah SOK sells for $570. Battleborn recently has raised their prices (inflation strikes again) However you can probably get one for under $900. I give SOK best bang for your buck status.

Walkabout will need two 100ah lithiums or one 200ah. So his lithium purchase now approaches $1200. In addition he’ll need a BVM. A Victron with Bluetooth capabilities, costs approximately $200.

Because he lives in the US, the OP can locate the lithium batter(ies) in the cabin - a major advantage. This shifts the lead acid battery weight from the tongue to the cabin (lithiums are half the weight of lead acids).

What can he now place alongside his BBQ in the Escape’s tongue storage box? A backup, inverter generator. This will allow him to use his microwave all day long and power his CPAP . Even if he’s stuck in the snow or mud under extensive cloud cover for several weeks.

Just sayin’

Are we talking Canadian or US dollars?

In the US, there are numerous sources for 200ah batteries less than $600

The victron Bluetooth shut is also around $130, and they are again, the high end option. The Renogy shunt is around $50.

[Jane P.]

Originally Posted by hugh

Are we talking Canadian or US dollars?

In the US, there are numerous sources for 200ah batteries less than $600

The victron Bluetooth shut is also around $130, and they are again, the high end option. The Renogy shunt is around $50.

Hi Hugh,
I’m talking US dollars. The lithium to buy right now is the SOK. It has great reviews for build quality & performance. It has a 7 year warranty which compares favorably against the Battleborn (my battery). There may be less expensive batteries on the market, but this is the one I would buy for peace of mind.

I do agree that he can find a less expensive alternative of equal quality to the Victron 712. This is something I pointed out in another thread.

[NEWYORKHILLBILLY]

Originally Posted by richm

My Resmed Airsense 10 CPAP consumes 4.5A when powered by a Resmed DC-DC adapter. It can be configured to shut off both the humidifier and heated tubing, and then consumes around 2.5A.

This is what I use. I have a inverter but would not want to run it all night for cpap machine.