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Old 01-09-2015, 09:15 AM   #41
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Another challenge in the southern states is lack of experience. There is a skill and procedure for clearing roads. If you have to plow 4 - 5 days a week, you get pretty good at it. When you have to plow 2 - 3 times per winter, you end up with a learning curve! Also, I've found that in the south, most days go above freezing. That allows the snow and ice to melt and flow across the roads. When that refreezes at night, we end up with black ice. Except for using studded snow tires, black ice is always a challenge.
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Old 01-09-2015, 09:16 AM   #42
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Jack, I like where your head is at with Retire as earlier as possible. I have 14 months left at the Fire Department and I'm grabbing my pension and running. I'll be 55 and ready to experience the next adventure while I'm healthy. Some people say it's too young, but I disagree. Have Fun while it's still fun !!
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Old 01-09-2015, 09:22 AM   #43
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Since my wife and I retired ,we finally have the time to travel South in the winter . We spend about 2 weeks in the South and that's long enough for us . We love living in the Midwest where there are 4 distinct seasons . We have -8 deg F this morning with bright sunshine and I have spent the last hour outdoors shoveling snow and enjoying every minute of it!
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:26 PM   #44
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[QUOTE=kstock11; Except for using studded snow tires, black ice is always a challenge.[/QUOTE]

Funny you should say that. Up to last weekend I thought that too. I gave my niece 4 studded snow tires for winter driving in the BC interior. I've used 4 studded snow tires previously and considered myself invincible with them. Just drive on by all those folks spinning their wheels.

Well my niece headed for the Interior last weekend with a big snow dump starting. Made it over the worst moutain pass, hit black ice and spun off onto the median. But I have to say, those studs do bite into the ice. When the car went sideways the bead was partly pulled off the rim. Oh well, she's a new driver, part of the learning curve. But I still swear by studded snow tires.

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Old 01-09-2015, 12:38 PM   #45
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Any Jamie Davis cameras around?
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Old 01-09-2015, 01:49 PM   #46
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While I didn't get to see this last winter, Lake Ontario, with the combination of cold temperatures (4F) and high winds has created 10' high ice mounds on the shore. Might not be a good day to take out the kayak!
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Old 01-09-2015, 01:50 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by Ron in BC View Post
Funny you should say that. Up to last weekend I thought that too. I gave my niece 4 studded snow tires for winter driving in the BC interior. I've used 4 studded snow tires previously and considered myself invincible with them. Just drive on by all those folks spinning their wheels.

Well my niece headed for the Interior last weekend with a big snow dump starting. Made it over the worst moutain pass, hit black ice and spun off onto the median. But I have to say, those studs do bite into the ice. When the car went sideways the bead was partly pulled off the rim. Oh well, she's a new driver, part of the learning curve. But I still swear by studded snow tires.

Ron
You might be interested in this report

http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/research/rep...orts/551.1.pdf
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Old 01-09-2015, 02:18 PM   #48
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Spent a couple hours snowshoeing on Big lake after work yesterday, watched the sun set over the lake and wished I had brought my camera. Was -28 C without the windchill. Was a bit chilly after the sun went down but was a beautiful evening.
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Old 01-09-2015, 02:29 PM   #49
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While I didn't get to see this last winter, Lake Ontario, with the combination of cold temperatures (4F) and high winds has created 10' high ice mounds on the shore. Might not be a good day to take out the kayak!
Could have been worse Jon,
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Old 01-09-2015, 02:36 PM   #50
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You might be interested in this report

http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/research/rep...orts/551.1.pdf
Interesting. As a former ice racer who raced on studded tires, non-studded and tractionized tires I find them really good. But part of that is likely my experience as my inexperienced niece so aptly pointed out

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Old 01-09-2015, 03:32 PM   #51
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Old 01-09-2015, 03:36 PM   #52
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While I didn't get to see this last winter, Lake Ontario, with the combination of cold temperatures (4F) and high winds has created 10' high ice mounds on the shore. Might not be a good day to take out the kayak!
Hi: Vermilye... It's so cold here we're having "Cryosesium's"...
Ice Quakes.
Casting a longing eye south~~~ Alf
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Old 01-09-2015, 07:12 PM   #53
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Me, I just drive circles around them in my big ass 4x4.
On the other hand, I drive a compact two-wheel-drive car with winter tires. Living in a rural area, I have never (in the couple of decades I've been in this location) had difficulty driving in to work and home... past the many 4X4's in the ditch (none of which are Jim, of course ).
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Old 01-09-2015, 07:18 PM   #54
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4x4

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On the other hand, I drive a compact two-wheel-drive car with winter tires. Living in a rural area, I have never (in the couple of decades I've been in this location) had difficulty driving in to work and home... past the many 4X4's in the ditch (none of which are Jim, of course ).
You do know that 4x4 's stop faster on glare / black ice. Just ask their owners when they get out of the ditch
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Old 01-09-2015, 07:20 PM   #55
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You 2x4 drivers are just jealous.
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Old 01-09-2015, 07:33 PM   #56
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On the other hand, I drive a compact two-wheel-drive car with winter tires. Living in a rural area, I have never (in the couple of decades I've been in this location) had difficulty driving in to work and home... past the many 4X4's in the ditch (none of which are Jim, of course ).
A good point. It's more about driving skill, although a well equipped vehicle makes it better. I remember a couple decades ago when I was in the Police Academy and we had to navigate through an obstacle course in a patrol car as part of tactical driving training. There were traffic cones everywhere. The object was to negotiate the course, sometimes going forward, and sometimes in reverse, as fast as possible, without knocking over any of the cones. I and a few others had a clear run, but most students knocked over multiple cones. I think it's because many folks don't have a "sense" of their vehicle -- where the corners are, where the wheels are, and what the vehicle is doing. They think you just 'point and shoot'. Mix in a little bad weather and that can spell disaster.
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Old 01-09-2015, 07:52 PM   #57
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Grew up in Wisconsin, so driving in snow/ice is not my problem. The other drivers are!

Commuted a few times on a motorcycle and was surprised by snow; learned how to go slow and use the feet for outriggers.
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Old 01-09-2015, 07:57 PM   #58
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You might be interested in this report

http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/research/rep...orts/551.1.pdf
Interesting. I have not yet had a chance to read the whole report, but just this statement shows that this 2002 report is not about current studded tires:
Quote:
The cost of studless tires is significantly higher than studded tires—by approximately 50 percent.
There are no longer distinctly different "studless" tires - there are winter tires which...
  1. are only available with studs
  2. are available with or without studs
  3. cannot be studded
Other than provision for studs, the construction of these tires (tread compound, tread pattern, carcass construction) is similar, and all available in a range of prices. Studdable tires have specific tread blocks which are arranged to be stable to accept a stud; non-studdable tires don't have any of these blocks. The other tread blocks are similar in either case.

A highly regarded brand for winter tires is Nokian. I currently use their non-studded (or "studless") Hakkapeliitta R2, and I am considering the studded Hakkapeliitta 8 for the next set. They are similar other than the studs, and as these links to the exclusive local distributor show, the price of the studded tires is a few dollars more than the non-studded... due to the extra cost of the studs.

Although there are many references to the Bridgestone Blizzak (enough to suspect bias), the specific studded tires used in tests was not apparent to me in a quick skim; I doubt any of them were modern winter tires.

I do appreciate the study authors' point that studs are useful only on ice... as we already realize. Ice is a frequent surface condition here.
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Old 01-09-2015, 07:58 PM   #59
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You do know that 4x4 's stop faster on glare / black ice. Just ask their owners when they get out of the ditch

Exactly!
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Old 01-09-2015, 07:59 PM   #60
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You 2x4 drivers are just jealous.
Nah... I think the 4x4 drivers are jealous of our fuel economy and handling.
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