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Old 02-05-2015, 07:32 PM   #191
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Originally Posted by Rossue View Post
What you say is true re Pilot/Highlander, however do you think a RAV4 would be better? The Mazda has the longest wheelbase and curbweight. The OP is asking for TV for 17B so am trying to think out of the box. Also, I understand that cost is important and know Toyotas sell sometimes for more used than new.
I agree with Glenn. A New RAV4 isn't going to work with a reduced towing capacity of 1500 lbs. They went in the direction of a car instead of what it used to be -- a very capable small SUV.

I do appreciate it when folks think outside of the box. The CX-9 could probably do a fine job towing a 17. It's just that I have no way of verifying that if the manufacturer won't give out the numbers needed - like GCWR.

I agree too that you pay a premium for a Toyota, but then you also enjoy higher resale value.
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Old 02-05-2015, 10:00 PM   #192
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I looked it up and the GCWR is 10,085 - 4,553 curb weight = 5,532 lbs left for people, cargo, and what we tow behind it.
Exactly.

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The GVWR is 6,050 which I guess means that if the truck is loaded, we can only tow a 4,000 GVWR trailer. This is sounding like the 17 might be more suitable and allow some leeway.
Yes, if you ever intend to carry 1500 pounds of people and cargo in the tug while towing then you need to plan for no more than 4000 pounds of trailer. The reality of life for most multipurpose vehicles is that they are used in different ways on different days: in this case, five people and a few hundred pounds of stuff one day, a driver and over half a ton of cargo another day... and perhaps two people, not baggage, and a 5000 pound trailer another day. I think the trick is to consider what combinations you need to accommodate for your purposes.

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I agree with Glenn. A New RAV4 isn't going to work with a reduced towing capacity of 1500 lbs. They went in the direction of a car instead of what it used to be -- a very capable small SUV.
I don't see much change in the vehicle at all, other than the discontinuation of the V6. The current 4-cylinder RAV4 has the same towing capacity as the previous 4-cylinder RAV4. Of course, that doesn't matter for those wanting to tow a travel trailer.

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I'm a fan of Mazdas, and I own a Mazda, but as a vehicle and not a tow. They generally have a lower towing capacity than similarly sized vehicles from other makes. A CX-9 has 3 rows of seating, and it's marketed in their brochures as a competitor of the Highlander and the Pilot. Yet, the Highlander and Pilot have much higher towing capacities.
That might have nothing to do with the vehicles, and everything to do with corporate approaches. I have a Mazda3, and Mazda endorses neither towing a trailer with this, nor flat-towing it (in various model years)... yet Mazda in other countries endorses substantial towing with the same (mechanically identical) car, and Ford in the North America endorses trailer towing (at least some years) and flat-towing their Focus which has the same chassis and transmission.

It's also possible that Mazda just doesn't have a transmission with enough capacity to allow the CX-9 to tow more; Toyota and Honda has a much broader range of larger models to share a higher-capacity transmission.

If I had a CX-9 I would certainly consider towing up to its rated limit.

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Also, I dislike it when a manufacturer won't post the GCWR so I can determine if it's suitable as a tow. Try finding the GCWR of a CX-9 and it's like looking for needle in a haystack. That number is important, and an owner can't calculate it. It comes from the manufacturer.
Yes, that can be a problem... and I think it's getting worse. I had to ask Ford customer service (not a dealer) to get someone to find a GCWR for my Focus. It seems like Toyota manuals have less loading information (such as GCWR) than the previously did for the same model. Maybe they need space to document all the "infotainment" junk that everything is full of now...
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Old 02-05-2015, 11:10 PM   #193
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Dang, wish I'd bought a CX-9 instead of that Murano. It would've been a better fit no doubt than the Murano for my 17B and wouldn't have needed that new Highlander which I traded in six months later after opting for a 21.

One spec I forgot to mention is it also has the best torque rating between it and the RAV/Highlander & Pilot: 270@ 4250 vs. 248@ 4700 & 253@ 4800 respectively.

While I know GCWR is truly important- does anyone think it would be less than a RAV4?

So, it has the longest wheelbase, the highest curb weight and best torque of above listed.
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Old 02-06-2015, 12:12 AM   #194
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I see that the CX-9 is built on the Ford CD3 platform, so as far as the chassis is concerned, it could have a GCWR comparable to the Fords on the same platform (previous gen Edge, etc), although the powertrain will more likely be the limiting factor.
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Old 02-06-2015, 12:23 PM   #195
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I am so confused now.
Just when I thought I had it all figured out!
Thank you all so much for the info and advice -- will continue my research and am just glad I have a few months to make a purchase.
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Old 02-06-2015, 01:03 PM   #196
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2015 Mazda CX-9 7-Passenger Vehicle - Specs & Features | Mazda USA
Select engine and mechanical option and scroll down to weights and capacities..
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Old 02-06-2015, 01:19 PM   #197
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I am so confused now.
Just when I thought I had it all figured out!
Thank you all so much for the info and advice -- will continue my research and am just glad I have a few months to make a purchase.
Ellen,
I re-read through all of this recently, just before we purchased a tow vehicle. I think my post (#3) still stands as a good possible summary of what has been discussed over the last month and a half.

BTW: Our choice: we just got a good deal on a 2011 Pilot (complete w/factory tow pkg.); we will add the 7 pin plug and plug-n-play harness at the rear (Curt 56097), and a P3 brake controller with plug and play harness (Tekonsha P3-3070P) under the dash, and will get the Pro Series WDH from ETI. And you thought it was Oh, so complicated.
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Old 02-06-2015, 03:06 PM   #198
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I tow a 2014 17B with a 2013 Honda Pilot and it tows just fine without the WDH. If you check the manual Honda does not recommend a WDH for towing with the Pilot, it does recommend a sway control if sway is an issue. I have towed in cross winds at highway speeds and sway has not been an issue.



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Ellen,
I re-read through all of this recently, just before we purchased a tow vehicle. I think my post (#3) still stands as a good possible summary of what has been discussed over the last month and a half.

BTW: Our choice: we just got a good deal on a 2011 Pilot (complete w/factory tow pkg.); we will add the 7 pin plug and plug-n-play harness at the rear (Curt 56097), and a P3 brake controller with plug and play harness (Tekonsha P3-3070P) under the dash, and will get the Pro Series WDH from ETI. And you thought it was Oh, so complicated.
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Old 02-06-2015, 03:22 PM   #199
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Originally Posted by Rossue View Post
While I know GCWR is truly important- does anyone think it would be less than a RAV4?
No, but I have no published numbers to go on, and different manufacturers take different approaches to calculating GCWR. Besides, GCWR may be lower on some and higher on some because the weight of the tow is higher or lower. For instance, A "low" GCWR may mean very little if the weight of the tow vehicle is low.The only accurate way to determine if the tow is suitable is to be under all the capacities, including GCWR. With a published number, I can determine the weight of all cargo and passengers, the weight of the trailer, and THEN I will know if I'm towing under the max.

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Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
I see that the CX-9 is built on the Ford CD3 platform, so as far as the chassis is concerned, it could have a GCWR comparable to the Fords on the same platform (previous gen Edge, etc), although the powertrain will more likely be the limiting factor.
Most likely true.

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Originally Posted by Jubal View Post
2015 Mazda CX-9 7-Passenger Vehicle - Specs & Features | Mazda USA
Select engine and mechanical option and scroll down to weights and capacities..
Yep, been there, done that Jubal. Thanks for proving my point about the scarcity of numbers. The only number they show is "towing capacity", which is only part of the picture in selecting a suitable tow.
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Old 02-06-2015, 04:38 PM   #200
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I tow a 2014 17B with a 2013 Honda Pilot and it tows just fine without the WDH. If you check the manual Honda does not recommend a WDH for towing with the Pilot, it does recommend a sway control if sway is an issue. I have towed in cross winds at highway speeds and sway has not been an issue.
Thanks, David, for the towing info. I noticed that bit by Honda when I read the manual. I'm doing some research into the ramifications of WDH use.
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