Behavior of turbocharged engines when towing

[Mike Lewis]

I bought my 2013 Tacoma in October 2013. It has 297,000 miles on it now and by its tenth birthday it will have 300,000. So that is my target for a new tow vehicle. At the end of that period (October 2033) I will be 77 years old and unlikely to still be towing for six- to eight-month trips around the country, if I'm still around and able to tow at all. But you never know.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by Mike Lewis

.... unlikely to still be towing for six- to eight-month trips around the country, if I'm still around and able to tow at all. But you never know.

We'll certainly hope for the best (for you and your next truck)!

[Rossue]

Originally Posted by Eggscape

I don’t think a lot of people realize that the Ecoboost Engine is more than just a sign that is stuck onto the truck…it is a technology that other manufacturers have not been able to even come close to.

Our safety in having enough power when towing is paramount at this time in our lives and I am very happy that what I consider a miracle engine is available.

Hey Ed- you had posted something similar back in 2019 and was a driving force behind my decision to replace my 2013 Yukon with 5.3 V with a 2019 Gen 4 Expedtion that only comes with the 3.5 EcoBoost engine/ ten speed transmission.

It has 42K on it and zero problems. It is a night & day difference in performance and comfort vs. the Yukon- which I had no particular complaints about. In the mountains is the real game-changer, so when we bought a new Ford Transit cargo van to convert to a camper we went with the 3.5 EcoBoost for it too. We can easily tow our 21 with it and have a "Mother-in-Law unit" for our kids we meet along our travels.

On the Ford Transit Forums there are some reports of EcoBoost vans with over 400K miles on them. The conventional thinking is other things will break down before the engine or turbos do. 4-5K max interval on oil changes is key.

[blue_bullet]

Originally Posted by SageRpod

That looks like a fine machine. Is it based off of the new Land Cruiser?

LC will have an I4Turbo and hybrid running regular. GX runs on premium w/ lousy gas mileage.

[Selkirk]

I recently towed my new 19 about 1500kms with a 2nd gen (4.0L) Tacoma, mostly through mountain territory. That experience confirmed that a TV upgrade, likely with a forced induction powertrain, will be necessary before I move forward with plans to travel more extensively in the future. My Tacoma's flatland towing performance is okay, but high-altitude climbs really challenge the truck's capabilities.

The abundance of power offered by the Ecoboost F150 or latest generation turbo V6 Tundra would make either an obvious choice. However, I really don't want a full size truck if it can at all be avoided.

I'll be very eager to gain insight about the power delivery, overall towing characteristics, and longevity of the new turbo 4-cylinder/manual transmission fourth gen Tacoma....as real world feedback becomes available.

[Mike Lewis]

Originally Posted by Selkirk

I'll be very eager to gain insight about the power delivery, overall towing characteristics, and longevity of the new turbo 4-cylinder/manual transmission fourth gen Tacoma....as real world feedback becomes available.

Indeed! That is another possibility.

[Chama]

We have a 2017 GMC Canyon Crew Cab short bed with the 2.8L diesel which we like and which tows our E-21 nicely. We were in Santa Fe and had some time, so I went truck shopping at the Ford dealer there thinking we might replace our Canyon with 111,000 miles on it.

Due to size limitations of our garage, I found I could not configure an F-150 as I had hoped... 6.5' bed, 3.5 Ecoboost, Extended Cab with the power outlets in the bed. You can only get the power outlets in a crew cab truck. The crew cab with the 6.5' bed is simply too long for our garage. Drats, back to the drawing board.

As for now, I guess we will have to keep our Canyon diesel going, whatever it takes.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by Chama

... I found I could not configure an F-150 as I had hoped... 6.5' bed, 3.5 Ecoboost, Extended Cab with the power outlets in the bed.

if by "power outlets in the bed" you mean the PowerBoost hybrid using the 3.5EB with onboard generator then yes, that's always required the Crew Cab because the hybrid battery uses space under the full rear seat. It can be had with a 5.5' box yielding the same shorter overall length as an extended cab with 6.5' box (seems there's always something compromised ).

Aside from the PowerBoost cab constraint, Ford dropped the extended cab (aka "SuperCab") on the Lariat trim in model year 2023, now it's only available on XLT and lower trims - an unfortunate loss for many buyers, IMO (but apparently not enough buyers to keep it available).

On the bright side, I would hope that with 'only' 111k miles your satisfying Canyon diesel has lots of life left in it!

[splitting_lanes]

Originally Posted by Chama

We have a 2017 GMC Canyon Crew Cab short bed with the 2.8L diesel which we like and which tows our E-21 nicely.

As for now, I guess we will have to keep our Canyon diesel going, whatever it takes.

Those diesels need a cam belt change at 150k miles, aside from that and fluid changes, it should be still going strong for another few hundred thousand miles

Hard to beat the miles per tank on that truck, I get around 450 miles on a tank of diesel towing

[pkgman51]

Originally Posted by Mike Lewis

This is all really good info, thanks. Apparently the turbo boost in these engines comes on at low RPMs, enabling the strong low-speed torque. Exactly what one would want when towing a trailer.

I have two more questions regarding these engines:

1. Does anyone using the Ford Eco-boost engine have really high mileage on their truck, like > 200,000 miles? If so, how has it held up?

2. Is anyone towing with the newer Tundra with its turbo V6? If so, how do you like it?

There is a great deal of information about EcoBoost engines on YouTube. It appears there are two issues that could be trouble. One is carbon on the valves because direct port ignition engines don't have gas washing over the valves when gas is being pumped into the cylinders. The second issue is with the "cam phasers". The issue causes a loud rattle upon start-up and is very, very expensive to resolve. I'm not sure of the frequency of these problems. They seem to happen at around 100M miles. Again, follow up with a YouTube search. The EcoBoost is a great engine that provides great torque. But...
Gary

[Centex]

Originally Posted by pkgman51

... It appears there are two issues that could be trouble. One is carbon on the valves because direct port ignition engines don't have gas washing over the valves when gas is being pumped into the cylinders.....

Respectfully, the term "direct port" is a bit of a confusing conflation.

Please note that for a number of years both the 2.7 and 3.5 EcoBoost in the F150 use a combination of both port (intake manifold) and direct (cylinder) injection to address that potential problem. I believe the 2.7 lagged the 3.5 in this respect for a few years but certainly by 2021 (Gen 14) model year the 2.7 also had both. Yes, there's two distinctly separate injectors for each cylinder.

The portion of fuel injected in the manifold port does indeed 'wash' the intake valves and stems. The consistent use of fuels having quality detergent packages is also helpful in this regard (my 3.5EB Owner's Manual specifically recommends the use of "Top Tier" fuel, though others may offer similar qualities).

When researching EcoBoost engines it can be important to ensure the information is pertinent to the specific version / displacement / vintage of interest.

[WillyB]

Originally Posted by pkgman51

There is a great deal of information about EcoBoost engines on YouTube. It appears there are two issues that could be trouble. One is carbon on the valves because direct port ignition engines don't have gas washing over the valves when gas is being pumped into the cylinders. The second issue is with the "cam phasers". The issue causes a loud rattle upon start-up and is very, very expensive to resolve. I'm not sure of the frequency of these problems. They seem to happen at around 100M miles. Again, follow up with a YouTube search. The EcoBoost is a great engine that provides great torque. But...
Gary

Where are you pulling this information from? Internet Chatter or Actual Documented?

[brroberts]

The 2.3 is only direct injection, but phaser issues have not been an issue on the Ranger forums. B

[pkgman51]

Originally Posted by WillyB

Where are you pulling this information from? Internet Chatter or Actual Documented?

Information I've found includes YouTube videos by certified Ford service techs, as well as other service techs who appear well-versed on the subject. I've also researched information posted by Ford who has issued service bulletins and extended warranties on the "Cam Phasers". I'm not trying to scare anyone, only trying to inform. I have a 3.5 EcoBoost and love it.


Gary

[Centex]

Originally Posted by pkgman51

.... I've also researched information posted by Ford who has issued service bulletins and extended warranties on the "Cam Phasers".

As you probably know, those are applicable to a certain range of years and applications.

Improvements have been made, these engines are subject to continuing improvement by Ford, broad-brushed albeit well-intentioned 'warnings' lacking full context can be misleading.

Not suggesting the current versions of the F150 EcoBoost are perfect, but they do seem to be a mature and robust pair of engines for consideration of new vehicle shoppers.

[pkgman51]

Goodbye Forum. It's obvious to me I'm not part of the clique here, nor smart enough for membership in this pseudo-intellects forum. It's been fun. Bye
Gary

[WillyB]

Originally Posted by pkgman51

Information I've found includes YouTube videos by certified Ford service techs, as well as other service techs who appear well-versed on the subject. I've also researched information posted by Ford who has issued service bulletins and extended warranties on the "Cam Phasers". I'm not trying to scare anyone, only trying to inform. I have a 3.5 EcoBoost and love it.


Gary

Thanks. I have the 3.5 EB and want to be sure to watch out for things that might cause issue. At 52000 miles mine seems to be going along just fine so far.

Fingers crossed.

[WillyB]

Originally Posted by pkgman51

Goodbye Forum. It's obvious to me I'm not part of the clique here, nor smart enough for membership in this pseudo-intellects forum. It's been fun. Bye
Gary

Don’t leave.

Opinions are like belly buttons. All are welcomed.

[Perry Butler]

All trucks have motor issues if you look close enough. A former Ford mechanic, now a RAM mechanic, felt the 3.5 EB was as reliable as the ancient Hemi engine. Every engine today is great, until it isn't.

Buy what YOU like.

Enjoy,

Perry

[Johnspierce]

Originally Posted by Mike Lewis

My 2013 Tacoma's normally-aspirated 4.0L V6 gets around 20 mpg driving around town and 13 mpg when towing, a decrease of about a third. This seems reasonable. I'm curious about the difference when towing with the turbocharged V6 engines that are popular now in the F-150 and other newer tow vehicles. Anyone have any data to share?

Yes, that seems reasonable. I don't think the turbo has as much to do with the mileage as much as torque does while towing.

What the turbo *does do* is give you more power at elevation than a non-turbo motor.

My 2021 GMC 2.8L 4-cylinder Canyon diesel gets the following:
- about 21mpg around town not towing
- about 28-30 mpg on the highway not towing
- about 16-19 mpg while towing.

It has almost 400 lb ft of torque which really helps in the Colorado mountains.