6V battery issue

[Vermilye]

The "Maximum Boost Button" is on the GoPower Solar Controller, and puts the controller output at 14.4V (assuming you have enough solar coming into the controller) for 30 minutes.

From what you have said in your posts, it appears that the solar part of the system is working. That leaves 2 likely problems - first that the batteries are bad, and second and more likely in my opinion with relatively new Trojan batteries is there is an unsuspected load on the system.

Without a method to measure outgoing current (such as a built in shunt such as the Victron Smart Shunt or 712), you need to use a multimeter to check. The amp reading on the GoPower solar controller only reads what is going out of the controller; it has no way of measuring what the trailer is using.

f you can find someone with a clamp on DC amp meter (most clamp on meters only read AC current) it is easy to measure the trailer load by clamping the meter around the hot wire that runs between the batteries & the converter (with the converter off (trailer disconnected from AC) and at night when the solar system is not working).

If you can't get ahold of a clamp on DC meter, and you are willing to blow a fuse in a standard multi meter, disconnect the positive lead going between the batteries & the converter at the battery, set the multimeter on amps, and put the leads (red or positive to the battery & negative to the wire), again with the solar & converter off. If the draw is more than the 10 amps most multi meters are fused at, the fuse will blow. If you see a reading under 10 amps, unplug each of the fuses to determine which is drawing the unsuspected current. One note - the propane detector, the refrigerator, even on propane, and if it is on, the TV amplifier will draw some current.

One suspect not mentioned so far is tank heaters. If you have them, be sure they are off.

[Civilguy]

Lisa & Pete

Have you been able to make any progress?

Jon's post is a good one. I have a world of respect for his opinion, especially regarding electrical. Tank heaters would be a very high draw which would really pull the batteries down quickly.

[BILLB]

Back to the basics for a second. Is your refrigerator an absorption style fridge and was it manually set to “off” or “propane” when you were doing your initial testing? If it was set on “automatic”, when no a/c power is available, some will default to propane and then 12volt. Others default to 12volt and then to propane.
Could be that with no a/c available, your fridge is defaulting to 12 volt. That would probably
not be a problem as long as you were hooked up to a tow vehicle and the engine was running. However if parked and disconnected, in would drain your batteries in no time.
Refer to your fridge operatiing instructions if unsure of how your automatic defaults work. In my opinion, it is best to manually select your refrigerator mode to a/c or propane rather than use the automatic mode. Never to 12 volt!

[Nrgtic4]

Thanks you so much to everyone for all the advice.
We appreciate it so much and will try to implement much of everything said .

We haven’t had time to try to secure a clamp on dc meter. Or do important electrical investigation like that yet. Pete has a multimeter, not very adept with it, -has not brought it out yet. (We have been busy helping out our youngest with childcare at their house)

I called the Trojan technical support line ( no help there at all) and called the Trojan battery places around the Bay Area. Some no longer carried or did the warranty on batteries ( in the case that they are the issue) One told me that I could remove the batteries from the trailer bring them in to be tested —- but their experience is only with golf carts and that they would say - even if they found an issue- that letting the batteries get so low would be considered to be “user error” and not covered under warranty.

The driveway we are staying at agreed to let us plug in yesterday ( Just for the day -24 hours only)
We are about to unplug now/ it’s been 24 hours….
Our go power readings right now (7:56 AM ) are;
90%. 13.7 volts. 0 amps

We have to leave (3 miles) for the day with our family and help out there.

Is there anything this plug in test should show us?
Will report back

[jontom]

just throwing darts but...could it be an issue with carbon monoxide detector?

[KevinA]

Jon mentions the tank heating pads at the end of his long post. Based on other discussions, it appears those pads are always ON unless you switch them off. They have a thermostat that’s supposed to turn them ON at 30 degrees and OFF at 40 degrees, but it may be stuck or has failed in the ON position so they continually draw. They would suck battery power rapidly.

According to the late Steve Dunham, “In my 2018 21ft Escape , the heat pad switches are under the driver’s side dinette seat. Lift up the plywood top and they are in the upper right hand corner as you face the seat.
Escape has labeled the switches.”

Worth checking! (Some E-19’ owners have said their tank heating switch is under the bed, instead.)

[alanmalk]

Originally Posted by jontom

just throwing darts but...could it be an issue with carbon monoxide detector?

On my '21 the carbon monoxide detector is part of the smoke detector which runs on its own AA batteries. Below my seat is a propane detector which is always running if the main switch is on. But the propane detector only draws about 150 milli-amps when running properly. That might be an issue after a number of weeks but unlikely to be a problem in just a few days.

Regardless, searching for "phantom" devices that are running when they should not is always a good idea. A simple DC amp meter from Amazon would work, as would a multi-meter on the amp setting. The only issue - as previously mentioned - is the meter's internal fuse will blow if the drain is over the limit.

[alanmalk]

Originally Posted by Nrgtic4

...
Our go power readings right now (7:56 AM ) are;
90%. 13.7 volts.
...

Here is a dart...

At 13.7 volts the power should indicate 100%.

Something is fishy here. (Actually, 100% for a lead-acid battery is around 12.9 V, I believe.)

[jontom]

correct alan. meant and should have said propane detector. and these devises do need to be replaced occasionally. and not knowledgeable about what potential draw would be if they malfunction. I guess I'm saying that I would disconnect anything that is always on to eliminate possible concerns.

[alanmalk]

Originally Posted by jontom

...
not knowledgeable about what potential draw would be if they malfunction.
...

With a malfunction, sky is the limit! (Or the wire limit, or the fuse limit if properly fused.)

[SeldomSeen]

Originally Posted by alanmalk

Here is a dart...

At 13.7 volts the power should indicate 100%.

Something is fishy here. (Actually, 100% for a lead-acid battery is around 12.9 V, I believe.)

If still plugged in and using the onboard (WFCO?) charger then 13.7vdc is about right. Because you are measuring the output of the charger across the battery. It will be lower if the charger is in float mode, higher if you catch it in bulk mode. (In any case using that charger on my trailer takes forever to fully charge to at least 100%).



The solar charging system that I installed (the good ol Bogart) requires me to tell it what 100% is so that it can keep track of amp-hours in/out. Battery voltage alone just does not tell the story.



If I really want to know the condition of the battery, I still need to check the specific gravity with a hydrometer. Pretty cheap, easy way to know. Should be able to pick one up at the local auto parts store.

[Vermilye]

Originally Posted by alanmalk

Here is a dart...

At 13.7 volts the power should indicate 100%.

Something is fishy here. (Actually, 100% for a lead-acid battery is around 12.9 V, I believe.)

For reasons only known to them, GoPower considers a full battery at 90% on their Solar Controller metering. The only time it will show 100% is after an equalization cycle, or after a couple of "Boost" cycles.

[Civilguy]

Originally Posted by Nrgtic4

Thanks you so much to everyone for all the advice.
We appreciate it so much and will try to implement much of everything said .

We haven’t had time to try to secure a clamp on dc meter. Or do important electrical investigation like that yet. Pete has a multimeter, not very adept with it, -has not brought it out yet. (We have been busy helping out our youngest with childcare at their house)

I called the Trojan technical support line ( no help there at all) and called the Trojan battery places around the Bay Area. Some no longer carried or did the warranty on batteries ( in the case that they are the issue) One told me that I could remove the batteries from the trailer bring them in to be tested —- but their experience is only with golf carts and that they would say - even if they found an issue- that letting the batteries get so low would be considered to be “user error” and not covered under warranty.

The driveway we are staying at agreed to let us plug in yesterday ( Just for the day -24 hours only)
We are about to unplug now/ it’s been 24 hours….
Our go power readings right now (7:56 AM ) are;
90%. 13.7 volts. 0 amps

We have to leave (3 miles) for the day with our family and help out there.

Is there anything this plug in test should show us?
Will report back

Hmm, Trojan and their dealer sure aren't worth anything here. You could have the batteries tested at any Autozone or similar auto parts store or battery shop.

I still like Jon's mention of the tank heaters as they would be a very large drain on the system. Please see if you can take time to look into that idea. Kevin's post #26 gives some guidance from Steve Dunham on the tank heater switch locations, (if you even have tank heaters).

A DC clamp meter is prohibitively expensive, at least I thought they were when I looked into them. I have an AC/DC meter with a clamp, but the clamp is only AC and that won't do the job here, so it can be confusing when you shop for one.

The refrigerator is another interesting idea. Running the refrigerator control board while you are on propane or electric power is a very minor load. But, if the fridge were to be switched to actually operating on 12 VDC that would drain batteries quickly, (if you even have a 12 VDC option on your fridge).

Plugging the trailer in to 120 VAC should have given it a good charge. If it quickly loses the charge again that suggests either 1) an unidentified load draining the batteries and/or 2) damaged batteries. But I would sure want to know there wasn't an unidentified load in the trailer before I put any new batteries in.

Have you been turning the battery off when not using the trailer lights, etc.? I think the solar would continue to charge the battery with it battery switched off, but I might be wrong as I haven't looked at where that on/off switch is in the circuit. Someone else here might know.

That's all I got.

[rubicon327]

Originally Posted by Civilguy

Have you been turning the battery off when not using the trailer lights, etc.? I think the solar would continue to charge the battery with it battery switched off, but I might be wrong as I haven't looked at where that on/off switch is in the circuit. Someone else here might know.

My recollection is that the solar system is wired on the battery side of the battery disconnect switch. One should be able to flip the switch and disconnect all DC loads in the trailer and still charge with solar. The exception might be the propane detector and trailer breakaway system. For these items it depends on the vintage of trailer. I’ve heard them wired both ways.

[emers382]

Originally Posted by Vermilye

For reasons only known to them, GoPower considers a full battery at 90% on their Solar Controller metering. The only time it will show 100% is after an equalization cycle, or after a couple of "Boost" cycles.

Thanks for this Jon, I wondered why the controller either shows 90 or 100 but never a figure in the 90's

[Nrgtic4]

Thanks to everyone for all their thoughts and suggestions! To say we really appreciate all your help and advice is a complete understatement. We are grateful for all who responded and this terrific community.

To answer a few questions : we do not have tank heaters and our fridge was running only set to propane and everything was off (as far as we know) every time we left the trailer.

The 24 hour plug in really helped fix things somehow and now I think our battery might be alright.
Here’s our latest stats:
———————————-
Saturday morning Dec 2d
AFTER disconnect from power cord our readings are
13.1 v 0.0 A 90%
————————————————-
Saturday Dec 2
At 11:0O at night on
86%. 12.7 0 amps

———————————-
Sunday Dec 3rd At 7:44 AM ( charged two iPhones and one Apple Watch overnight )
12.7 83% 0.0 amps
—- ————————-
Sunday Dec 3rd 8:27 AM
after a light on and water pump a few minutes
81% 12.6
——————————————
Sunday Dec 32d. at 8:20 pm after being away all day
79% 12.6 v and 0.0
——————————————
Monday Dec 4th morning 8:50 AM
72%. 12.4 v. 0.0 amps
————————————

[Randy in Maine]

I just bought one of these to desulfate my batteries. It might be the sort of thing you need to do.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...KIKX0DER&psc=1

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by Randy in Maine

I just bought one of these to desulfate my batteries. It might be the sort of thing you need to do.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...KIKX0DER&psc=1

I believe the OP has AGM batteries, and I don't think you can run desulfate on them.

btw, NOCO are excellent battery chargers, but a 5A would take a long time to charge a discharged dual golf cart battery.

[Hawkeye Ed]

Lifeline makes great AGM batteries. On the Lifeline web site it says this about sulfation prevention at <https://lifelinebatteries.com/blog/4-effective-ways-to-maintain-your-agm-battery-and-keep-it-durable/>

Sulfation prevention
When the sulfuric acid found in the lead-acid batteries react, especially in the negative plate, it will form lead sulfate, which results in sulfation. Sulfation reduces the battery’s ability to hold a charge. Keeping your AGM battery charged during and before storage will help to avoid the process of sulfation. In case sulfation occurs on your AGM battery, use a desulfation charge to reverse the sulfation. You can also use the AGM battery recommended charger to lower the impact of sulfation.

[Perry Butler]

Originally Posted by Nrgtic4

When we attended the Fiberglass rally in Quartzite in February, we had noticed that our batteries were not holding onto their charge as well as they had used to
so we replaced our original batteries with
Trojan T105 6V -225 AH deep ones

Our new batteries are NOT only not holding on to their charge, but are getting down to readings in the 40% -50% range with very little use by us.

We’ve been maintaining their water levels every month and just refilled it.

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

I believe the OP has AGM batteries, and I don't think you can run desulfate on them.

As you can see from Nfgtic4's original post they have been refilling their the water levels in their battery, so their batteries are not AGM's, but flooded Trojan 105's. Perhaps all they need is a couple of desulfations. I always tried to desulfate any battery that was taken below 75% SOC.

Food for thought,

Perry