Towing on snow covered roads...

[kavm]

We are embarking on our circuitous trip to Big Bend in a couple of days. While we have minimized our time through the snow country, we are likely to encounter snow somewhere, including as early as this Friday when we start from Cedar City towards St George and beyond. Our configuration is F150 (w/4WD optional) pulling E5.0TA.

First, 4WD - From what I have read, 4H is the right setting to use for F150 in snow, but not sure if that remains the preferred setting when towing in snow.

Second, I am thinking that we have a heavy 150 (Hybrid are heavier) with more weight on the rear tires. So, the stability should be good. The trailer tires, however, do not have much weight on them, but the 5th wheel configuration should keep them in line. Is that about right? Any thoughts, advice or experience that might help us?

We have some snow driving experience but it is while driving a car with snow tires. This will be the first time with the truck and camper.

Thanks a lot!

[Perry Butler]

Growing up and living in central Minnesota for most of my life, plus farming for 23 years, I have tens of thousand of miles pulling trailers/wagons on snow/ice covered roads. Slow down, keep double the normal space in front of you (no tailgating), watch your mirrors, and never hit the brakes. Learn how to use your transmission. Do NOT travel in 2wd in snow and ice! We used to drive in 4wd, but now with AWD on our 2019 F150 AWD is preferred.

For 19 years we lived on I94 in central Minnesota. We'd see pickups and Suburban type vehicles fly by us at 70 or more mph, only to see many of them littering the ditch, or worse yet have an accident, some because they just can't quit tailgating.

Three winters ago we left on January 15 heading east with our 5.0 to Albert Lea, MN where we headed south on 35. At about the Iowa border we ran into glare ice! I just flipped to AWD, slowed to 45 mph, kept my distance, and 2 hours later when we got to Ames, Iowa the glare ice was gone. We continued on good roads in 2WD to Cracker Barrel in Kansas City, Kansas.

Only drive in a manner that you feel comfortable and safe. Once driving our Odyssey (had the optional automatic transmission lock) back from Des Moines to our home in Ashby, MN we ended up getting a motel room in Mason City, IA, because of heavy side winds and icy roads. Even if we had 4WD we still would have gotten a motel room.

Food for thought,

Perry

[Viajante]

My experience is that the trailer doesn’t affect towing in snow very much because the trailer wheels aren’t drive wheels. The exception being greater vulnerability to side winds if conditions are slippery.

However, the braking is a concern because the trailer wheels, like the truck wheels need a good surface to work. Allow more braking distance, just as you would for a truck. And don’t set the brake control gain too high or it will easily lock the trailer wheels so they only slide.

[kavm]

Thank you to both of you! That is helpful.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by kavm

...First, 4WD - From what I have read, 4H is the right setting to use for F150 in snow, but not sure if that remains the preferred setting when towing in snow. ....

As I recall your F150 is a higher-trim model (Lariat or higher trim) with the option of 2L, 4L, 4H, or 4A (aka "4WD Automatic") on your dashboard transfer case selector. At least on 2021+ F150s the 4A setting is not available on trims below the Lariat.

As mentioned by Perry, I suggest that 4A, which is essentially Ford's version of AWD (All Wheel Drive) on the F150, is your best choice for driving on slippery pavement at any speed, towing or otherwise. That setting will send torque (drive force) to whichever wheel(s) need it based on demand and available traction at each wheel (the system is in fact called "TOD" = "Torque-On-Demand").

Note that it is safe to use 4A full-time on any pavement, dry or slippery, so you don't need to change out of this setting if you are running on alternating 'dry' and 'slippery' surfaces. IMO it's great when driving in rain or intermittent showers when slippery surfaces can be encountered off-and-on while driving.

4H by contrast, is only recommended when in "deep" snow, a consistently very 'loose surface' situation that you are not likely to encounter on maintained paved roads even in winter. 4H should only be used when there is absolutely no chance of even intermittent good traction lest the drivetrain 'bind' when turning, with potentially damaging results.

Separate but in addition to the 4A (Torque On Demand) transfer case setting there's the "Slippery Mode" which can be selected using the "Drive Mode" button to further enhance driving control on slippery surfaces. See the attached excerpt from your owners manual, noting this is specifically recommended for "snow or ice covered roads". This Drive Mode should not be used on dry pavement because it can automatically shift from the default always-safe 4A to 4H with attendant 'binding' risks.

Hope that helps, y'all have a great trip!

[John in Santa Cruz]

on my 2019 Ferd, admittedly an Expedition, not a F150, but it has the same drive train, they did away with 4H. it just has 2H, 4A, 4L, and the 4th position is a rear axle lock. The drive mode has a position for snow (but also a position for tow, so...).

When I got my first truck with a true 4x4, my son, who had a lot more offroad experience than I did, said, use 2H until you get stuck, then use 4H or 4L to get unstuck. if you get stuck in 4H/4L, the tow truck won't even show up. of course, he was talking about mud and sand more than snow.

Good tires is IMHO the most important thing here. I use All Terrain tires that have the 3PMSF (3 Peak Mountain Snow Flake) icon,

as these are better on snow and ice than simple M+S tires. My favorite all around truck tires are the BF Goodrich A/T KO2 series. Also on very slippery surfaces, back off the gain on your trailer brake controller, as the trailer wheels will lock up easier otherwise.

[Centex]

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

.... Also on very slippery surfaces, back off the gain on your trailer brake controller, as the trailer wheels will lock up easier otherwise.

Thanks for adding this very good point

[brroberts]

Unlike Perry, I do tow on bad roads in 2WD. It’s all I have, and I find it sufficient. I try to plan around snowy icy roads, but when I can’t, I slow down and drive more carefully. I personally don’t find 4WD necessary, just convenient, and that includes 25 years of living in Alaska. If you have it; however, it can be helpful, but not a cure for ice on the road.

[Ynnde]

What John in Santa Cruz said +1

Any type of 4wd will help you be more confident in getting going from zero and AWD may make you "feel" safer at higher speeds however it's all tire quality for either stopping or from being blown sideways. Never Cruise Control when the surface is the least bit suspicious.

[kavm]

Thank you so much for all the useful advice. I will go with 4A (thanks Alan and John) and back the gain control on the camper breaks off from 6 to 5.

[Perry Butler]

Originally Posted by brroberts

Unlike Perry, I do tow on bad roads in 2WD. It’s all I have, and I find it sufficient. I try to plan around snowy icy roads, but when I can’t, I slow down and drive more carefully. I personally don’t find 4WD necessary, just convenient, and that includes 25 years of living in Alaska. If you have it; however, it can be helpful, but not a cure for ice on the road.

We're all different and we need 4WD about once or twice a year with our camper. Plus, we live in hills with lots of ice in the winter, so good for just the winter situations we have here. Our Prius was a joke on ice and hills, but now we have a Subaru Outback that works well on ice and hills.

You're totally correct in that 4WD is not a cure for ice on the road. It is merely an aid.

Food for thought,

Perry

[brroberts]

Our Subbie was great on icy hills in Alaska too, but was the least reliable, most expensive on repairs, and biggest piece of junk I’ve ever owned. It cost me $1000’s to keep on the road, and in spite of their reputation, I’ll never own another. Barb drove the Subbie to work, I drove my 2WD truck. I gladly still have the truck. The Subbie was junked years ago, but it was great on ice. I went to work on icy hills year round in the truck without chains.

I really think correct tires are a bigger issue than 2WD vs 4WD.

[Perry Butler]

Originally Posted by brroberts

Our Subbie was great on icy hills in Alaska too, but was the least reliable, most expensive on repairs, and biggest piece of junk I’ve ever owned. It cost me $1000’s to keep on the road, and in spite of their reputation, I’ll never own another. Barb drove the Subbie to work, I drove my 2WD truck. I gladly still have the truck. The Subbie was junked years ago, but it was great on ice. I went to work on icy hills year round in the truck without chains.

I really think correct tires are a bigger issue than 2WD vs 4WD.

Sorry to hear your Subbie was an outlier. I know many who have Subaru's in Minnesota and none have had more than one major problem and most none.

Sorry, but where I live tires won't come close to providing the traction one gets with 4WD. BTDT!

Food for thought,

Perry

[John in Santa Cruz]

my uncle lived in rural New Hampshire, where the winters are long and nasty, and had a heating components wholesale business that required making emergency deliveries all winter long. He drove 60s/70s Ford LTD and Country Squire full sized wagons, with limited slip differentials and snow tires on all 4 wheels, often with over 1000 lbs of cargo, things like broad selections of oil burner nozzles, pumps, valves. his friend always talked about putting a Country Squire body on a 4x4 chassis for him, but as he put 50K miles/year on his delivery car, he'd have a new one every 4 years, so the effort to build something custom would be wasted.

[salmo7000]

Hmmm, a couple of years ago I was towing my 19 home from a camping trip in Montana in early September. An unexpected cold front came through, and there was 5” of wet, heavy snow on Roger’s Pass, which was not plowed. Since I have 4WD you can bet I used it, and I had no trouble climbing up to the pass. The way down, however, was completely terrifying. As others have pointed out, 4WD will not help you slow down or stop, especially with the weight of a trailer behind you. I literally crawled down from the top of Roger’s. I did not use low gear or the exhaust brake on my diesel pickup, fearing that would put it into a skid. I just very lightly braked when I had to. Everything I did worked, and I made it down with no mishap. Perhaps there was a better way, I don’t know. The main point here is I went super slow, like no more than 25 mph.

From that time on, I’ve avoided towing on snow like the plague. For sure if you have to go up and over mountain passes, that adds a level of complexity onto the driving, whether towing or not.

[bborzell]

We came through Wyoming a year ago last May during a blizzard. Stayed in Cheyenne for a night in the low 20s.

As we were getting ready to leave the RV park, I noticed a RAM 3500 pulling a long 5th wheel getting ready to pull out. The driver blasted out of the park like he had to be somewhere fast.

Wasn’t snowing on I80 yet, but it wasn’t long before we caught up to the 5th wheel surrounded by State Troopers and large tow vehicles. Blowing and drifting snow, a bit of black ice and, I am guessing, excessive speed resulted in a jackknife.

Slow is about the best advice short of staying to wait out the storm.

[emers382]

Thanks Alan for your comments above re 4A. I have copied your post into a note.

We have been extra cautious now when traveling in the winter since we jackknifed with the trailer rushing home from Georgia in Mar 2020, not that I was rushing when the oopsie took place. This winter we need not worry since we're not leaving the country due to Beth's recent heart attack. Just hope we don't encounter snow heading to the Escape rally in May!

[Centex]

Originally Posted by emers382

... We have been extra cautious now when traveling in the winter since we jackknifed with the trailer rushing home from Georgia in Mar 2020, not that I was rushing when the oopsie took place....

I might be wrong but it's my understanding that the particular situation of a 'jackknife' is often caused by the tug 'out-braking' the trailer. That is, the tug brakes (or engine deceleration) slowing the tug more than the trailer brakes slow the trailer, especially on slick surfaces or when the tug and trailer are not in perfect alignment (as in a curve).

Methinks that John in Santa Cruz's caution to dial-back trailer brake gain on slick surfaces is key (more so than any vehicle setting) in mitigating this risk .... 'locked trailer brakes' = 'no effective trailer brakes' especially when on a slick surface. An essentially un-braked trailer behind a braking or slowing tug will try to 'pass the tug' (jackknife).

Just for your consideration.

[iamunique127]

There is lots of good advice here already.

4WD can get you going but it can not help you stop. You need traction to stop and the way to increase your traction (not make you invulnerable) is to have the proper tires. All season tires just do not cut it on ice and snow, especially if you have excess weight, like hauling a trailer.

We get lots of snow and ice here. Our provincial insurer gives discounts on our rates if we instal winter tires and they will finance the purchase of the tires, which demonstrates how important they believe proper tires are for the conditions. Some ppl even run studded tires.

Like someone said, sometimes it is just best to take a motel and wait until the roads are plowed and sanded. Better safe than sorry.

[Perry Butler]

Originally Posted by iamunique127

There is lots of good advice here already.

4WD can get you going but it can not help you stop. You need traction to stop and the way to increase your traction (not make you invulnerable) is to have the proper tires. All season tires just do not cut it on ice and snow, especially if you have excess weight, like hauling a trailer.

We get lots of snow and ice here. Our provincial insurer gives discounts on our rates if we instal winter tires and they will finance the purchase of the tires, which demonstrates how important they believe proper tires are for the conditions. Some ppl even run studded tires.

Like someone said, sometimes it is just best to take a motel and wait until the roads are plowed and sanded. Better safe than sorry.

I guess we'll just have to differ here. Most I know want all-season tires on ice and since the advent of all-season tires I haven't bought winter snow tires, despite living in snowy central Minnesota.

However, when talking about deep snow there is an advantage to snow tires, but we just don't go out in deep snow anymore. Plus, I certainly won't drive my trailer in deep snow anyway, so that's a moot point. We look for a good weather window to start our winter trip, and certainly don't want snow tires buzzing, reducing our gas mileage, when down south.

Just my opinion,

Perry