Tow Vehicle for Escape 19 and Escape 17

[padlin]

Moved some post to https://www.escapeforum.org/forums/f...ons-18603.html

[Radar1]

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

whats the GWR on the new 19's? The old ones were 4500 lbs, I believe, same as my 'classic' 21...

I don't ever base my towing weight calculations on 'empty' weights, but rather on 'actual' weights which in my experience tend to be right up against the GWR.

5,000 lbs on the new 19's and 21's, 4,000 lbs on the 17's.

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by Radar1

5,000 lbs on the new 19's and 21's, 4,000 lbs on the 17's.

did they beef up the frames for that? or just rated them higher? they already have a pair of 3500 lb axles, afaik, so its not the wheels or suspension holding them back.

[Radar1]

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

did they beef up the frames for that? or just rated them higher? they already have a pair of 3500 lb axles, afaik, so its not the wheels or suspension holding them back.

Not sure when they changed the GVWR. They used 3" frames on the 17, 19, and 21 until 6 years ago, when they switched to 4" frames, so perhaps that had something to do with it, or when they redesigned for 2nd gen Escapes? I believe the 5.0 TA still uses 3" frame.
There was a recall concerning the old frames about 5 years ago.

[TTMartin]

Originally Posted by Doug in NC

We just ordered an Escape 19. We have a Jeep Cherokee Laredo V6 3.6L that the specs say has a towing capacity of 5000 pounds. I am seeing posts here that make me think that is insufficient to tow the 19. The dry weight of the 19 is 3250 pounds. I know that I will be adding a few hundred pounds with water and gear, but what's the deal?

The Escape 19 has a GVW of 5000 lbs. There is no reason you can't tow it with a vehicle that has a 5000 lb tow rating. Most manufactures are very conservative with their tow ratings to start with. And then you get people who think you should be 'extra conservative' above that.

[steve dunham]

Escape lists the GVWR for our Escape 21C at 5000 lbs
So for registration, licensing , insurance and tow vehicle purposes it weighs 5000 lbs

[Radar1]

Originally Posted by TTMartin

The Escape 19 has a GVW of 5000 lbs. There is no reason you can't tow it with a vehicle that has a 5000 lb tow rating. Most manufactures are very conservative with their tow ratings to start with.

I just looked at the weights of the four 2nd gen 19' Escapes on the trailer weights spreadsheet. Two of them had tongue weights over 500 lbs (520 and 650), so if someones 5,000 allowable trailer weight also comes with a 500 lb tongue weight limit then they might get close, especially with the extra weight of the front box and contents, plus dual batteries in that box.
One 19' had just a 330 lb tongue weight with only a 3344 lb total weight, so I suspect that particular one had few options. (Our shipping weight is listed as 3609 lbs empty)

[Rossue]

Originally Posted by Radar1

Not sure when they changed the GVWR. They used 3" frames on the 17, 19, and 21 until 6 years ago, when they switched to 4" frames, so perhaps that had something to do with it, or when they redesigned for 2nd gen Escapes? I believe the 5.0 TA still uses 3" frame.
There was a recall concerning the old frames about 5 years ago.

21 has always had a 4" frame.

[TTMartin]

Originally Posted by Radar1

I just looked at the weights of the four 2nd gen 19' Escapes on the trailer weights spreadsheet. Two of them had tongue weights over 500 lbs (520 and 650), so if someones 5,000 allowable trailer weight also comes with a 500 lb tongue weight limit then they might get close, especially with the extra weight of the front box and contents, plus dual batteries in that box.
One 19' had just a 330 lb tongue weight with only a 3344 lb total weight, so I suspect that particular one had few options. (Our shipping weight is listed as 3609 lbs empty)

Tongue weight can and should be adjusted based on how you load the trailer.

Everything you load behind the rear axle decreases the tongue weight.

Everything you load in front of the front axle increases the tongue weight.

Put a bike carrier and two bikes in the rear hitch receiver and you decrease the tongue weight.

Put a Blackstone Grill in the outside compartment under the bed and you decrease the tongue weight. Move that Blackstone Grill into the front storage box and you increase the tongue weight.

Load the Eggscape's 8 milk crates under the bed and you decrease the tongue weight. Move those items up under the dinette seat and you increase the tongue weight.

You should load your trailer to adjust the tongue weight.

The majority of the storage space in an Escape 19 is under the bed, it would be just as easy to load the trailer to reduce the over 500 lb tongue weights it as it would be to load it to increase the 330 lb tongue weight.

[Radar1]

Originally Posted by Rossue

21 has always had a 4" frame.

Your correct, I misquoted and it was the 15', 17', and 19' that had the recall (not the 21")

[gbaglo]

My 2008 17B was not under recall.

[Doug in NC]

This thread is near to my on screen focus right now. We have a deposit down on a 2021 Escape 19 and we own a 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo V6. On the door frame sticker it says our GVWR is 6500. I know the vehicle weight is about 4850 pounds, but the sticker also says the max cargo, including passengers, is 1050 pounds. So something is wrong. According to the Jeep dealer in New Bern, NC the max tongue weight is 500 pounds and towing max is 5000 pounds.

In an email message to me the Escape folks have answered my question about tongue weight with a promise to test the tongue weight of the 19 with two filled propane tanks and two 6V batteries. The storage box is optional, so it will not be included.

There are a lot of variables in any tongue weight formula, but how you load gear and food and clothes will surely be among them. Another is the options you choose and their location. The spec page for the 19 on the Escape website says the hitch weight is 306 pounds. If you get the storage box and put 100 pounds of gear inside, add the power hitch lift, have both LP tanks full, and stow your 50 pound tool box under the dinette seat, it is possible to ease over the 500 pounds. But, as was stated earlier, a loaded bike rack could reduce the tongue weight.

From my math days in college (I remember being in those classes, but do not remember much of the material) I know there is a formula for measuring weights balanced on a fulcrum that includes the distance of the weights from the fulcrum. So, theoretically, a ten pound addition to the storage box could be offset by some weight on the bike rack. But it will not be ten pounds because the distance from the trailer wheels (aka, the fulcrum) is much lees than the distance to the storage box.

Maybe this is too much stuff and perhaps one of you is an engineer with that formula embedded in cache. If so, feel free to correct me.

[Rossue]

I think you may regret not getting the storage box. This reminds me of when we were shopping for an Escape after suddenly retiring. Had a Nissan Murano with 3.5 V6 and thought it was strong enough for a 19. Escape said no- so we bought a 17B. Then we decided we needed bigger and got a 21 and a Full-size SUV- after buying an AWD Highlander to better tow the 17B! So as many others here and elsewhere remind: carefully pick the trailer that suits all your needs then get the right tow vehicle. You cannot believe all the contortions with my build sheet I was going through trying to make the new Highlander work with the 21. Some do it, yet we live where we climb a LOT of steep mountain passes. No regrets with the Yukon we traded the Highlander for and now with the Expedition and 3.5 EcoBoost we couldn't be happier with towing and don't worry about what we're carrying(which is usally too much- not to mention the rocks Susan always has to bring home!)

[Sailingmiker]

As mentioned in an earlier posting in this thread, we tow our 2015 19’ Escape with a 2017 Nissan Frontier. We have been to Southern California, back and all around the Olympics in Washington state. I have been towing all kinds of trailers with quite a variety of tow vehicles over the years and I am very comfortable with our current rig.

We have the box on the tongue with two 6v batteries, twin propane bottles and an electric tongue jack. Our tongue weight is right around 400 pounds ( It varies a bit with the contents of the box). Our TV is a V6 4wd crew cab. The Frontier and the E19 are very compatible within their spec ranges.

We may be a little slow going up big hills but being retired with plenty of time on my hands it doesn’t bother me to not go the speed limit up big hills. The Frontier is my daily driver. My biggest concern was addressed this past January when behind a box truck I was forced to make a panic stop in traffic. With good brakes on the trailer having been activated by my electronic brake controller the stop came about with out skidding or swerving. IMHO brakes are more important than horsepower.

I get it that bigger might be better but that is not always the case. Consider all the options and go with what works best for you. I know of E19 owners who tow with Highlanders, Ridgelines, Tacoma’s, Tundras and F150s and they are all happy with their choices.

[Red]

The 19 has a large storage area and the fresh water tank to the rear of the wheels. You can counter balance a heavy tongue weight on the 19 by moving heavy items to the rear storage under the bed and by carrying more fresh water. If you are boon docking and want to carry a full load of fresh water you can counter balance by moving some weight forward. When i picked up our 19 from the factory I had the E2 hitch installed. They adjusted the hitch with a 1/3 load of fresh water, full propane tanks and the batteries installed. It has been a great set up and level under all load conditions and I do not need air bags to make adjustments.

[Clkr]

Hi! I see that you have towed an e19 with a frontier. I have a pro4x and just ordered an e19. Any words of wisdom or thoughts on that combo?

[Sailingmiker]

My only suggestion would be turn off the overdrive when driving on roads with a lot of short ups and downs. I have found that my 2017 Frontier with an automatic transmission shifts in and out of overdrive to a point of annoyance when driving in those conditions. Other than that I have found the Frontier to be a good tow vehicle for the 19'.

[Doug2000]

Originally Posted by Sailingmiker

My only suggestion would be turn off the overdrive when driving on roads with a lot of short ups and downs. I have found that my 2017 Frontier with an automatic transmission shifts in and out of overdrive to a point of annoyance when driving in those conditions. Other than that I have found the Frontier to be a good tow vehicle for the 19'.

I'm sure if you read your instruction manual it will say to not tow in overdrive. Every time your transmission shifts from OD to 4th, there is a substantial amount of heat generated. I suggest you use a ScanGauge2 to monitor your transmission temps. I tow in 4th gear most time and only OD on the flats or downhill. I'm sure, pulling in OD with a Frontier it's time to change your transmission fluid.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XxPsBD1qAQ

[harvest]

Originally Posted by yardsale

That is impressive towing mileage. How fast? Any hills? An earlier post mentioned the CVT is problematic for towing on hills. Your thoughts?

Hi, did you hear an answer about this? We are looking at Ascent and Highlander, maybe Atlas or Pilot too. Thinking about the 3 row SUV for pulling a 17/19 Escape.
Thanks

[Radar1]

Originally Posted by harvest

Hi, did you hear an answer about this? We are looking at Ascent and Highlander, maybe Atlas or Pilot too. Thinking about the 3 row SUV for pulling a 17/19 Escape.
Thanks

Don't know about either of those vehicles for towing, but our Dodge Durango V6 has a 6200 lb tow rating with the tow package, and pulls our 2020 19' well. It has three row seating.