Another frame failure, 2013 15 B

[ghosthunter]

Well over the past weekend we joined the frame failure club.

The frame completely separated on our 15 B. We were lucky that we had just pulled into campsite.

Other frame failures can be referenced here. Ours is not the first.
https://www.escapeforum.org/forums/f...17b-23852.html

Here is our story.

It started with me parking the trailer in the driveway in September,winterized. Plugged in to shore power. In January 2023 I was getting the trailer ready for a weekend trip when I noticed the 12 volt lights were not working. And that my front storage box lid was lightly rubbing when opened on the front of shell.
Non of this made sense to me at the time and since I had full hook ups at my destination I ga e up on solving electrical. And went on my trip.

We arrived at campsite and when I went to open front storage it would not open. The shell was hard against the box.
Further inspection showed our frame on both sides was broken. A welder was called and repairs were made so we could tow home.
The light problem was created by the frame issue.

I have a appointment to have frame permanently repaired.

More info.

I am the third owner of this trailer.

The factory recall repairs were completed on this trailer.

The break on both sides were near the edge of the welded on stabilizers, behind them. There was also a bolt in that location through the frame.

Photos

1. Picture of mend
2. Shows factory recall fix.
3. Shows top of mend.

[ghosthunter]

I will meet with welder tomorrow, but my thought is that a support tube be welded underneath current frame as back as the step on both sides. I am thinking stabilizer needs to be removed and reinstalled.

The drivers side is more complicated because the sewer line runs along the frame on the outside.

[HABBERDABBER]

Complex stuff occurs on a trailer frame during use to produce the failure.
It can be fixed, better than new. It just takes getting the right skilled welder to cobble the patches.

[Iowa Dave]

I have posted before that I am a believer in a bonded certified welder. Maybe because my brother held several certifications and welded on P&H cranes produced for military contract. There’s no doubt it can be welded stronger than new as long a the metal is there. Just so the welds don’t look like turkey poo when done. Right rod or wire, right heat, good substrate, right thickness and makeup of bracing and proper application technique for the music to have harmony.
Iowa Dave

[Mike G]

Originally Posted by Iowa Dave

I have posted before that I am a believer in a bonded certified welder. Maybe because my brother held several certifications and welded on P&H cranes produced for military contract. There’s no doubt it can be welded stronger than new as long a the metal is there. Just so the welds don’t look like turkey poo when done. Right rod or wire, right heat, good substrate, right thickness and makeup of bracing and proper application technique for the music to have harmony.
Iowa Dave

Good point. Plenty of "welders" are not as good as they should be. Heh, I've never welded anything, but I hear a wire welder can be learned in 10 minutes; give me one of those and I'm sure I can fix a trailer frame to hold together long enough for the check to clear!

[brroberts]

Wire welders are fast to learn if you want to make bad welds. I bought one with a spool gun and do a little self taught welding. If it was important, I’d hire someone. For other stuff, the welder has more than paid for itself.

[ghosthunter]

Well to day I took the trailer to my RV restoration shop and they spent half hour under it, discussing what could be done.

Complicating things is that it broke directly behind the septic line coming out of the toilet.

And the insulation.

We then decided a welding fabrication shop needed to be involved. Since I knew the best one around I took the trailer over there. They told me no question that they could repair it and beef it up. But the insulation is the problem because it is very flammable.

So I am removing insulation from the work area now. And than returning it to the Fab shop.

[Iowa Dave]

I had two mechanics under my crew strength when I was parks superintendent. One was a combat engineer who built helispots in the jungles of viet nam and had to keep the equipment running and the other was an underwater welder on a nuclear submarine. Those guys could really weld. But when a big oak tree blew down and cracked a steel beam on a picnic pavilion roof I inspected the damage with them and we determined it would be in the cities best interest to hire a structural engineer I went to Iowa State with and a certified welder to cut out and section in a new piece. The management thought it was expensive overkill. I trumped with a letter from the city attorney. And never worried about it again.
Salis Populi Suprema Lex (the peoples safety is the highest law)
Iowa Dave

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by Mike G

G
but I hear a wire welder can be learned in 10 minutes; give me one of those and

Originally Posted by brroberts

Wire welders are fast to learn if you want to make bad welds.

I belonged to a car building forum for a long time. Some folks just bought a hundred dollar cheapo welder using flux core wire and did absolutely horrifying welds. Fortunately for me I had a Millermatic with migmix. Cost a tad more than the cheapo ones but did pro level welds. Even then, I TIG welded all the critical points, like the suspension brackets. In Canada, if you build your own car, you have to have a government Structural Integrity Inspection. I'm guessing that in some other jurisdictions they're not as strict.

Originally Posted by ghosthunter

And than returning it to the Fab shop.

Looking forward to seeing the finished work.

Ron

[ghosthunter]

Well they wanted me to remove insulation away from frame because of fire concerns.

So I took the challenge today and removed insulation 12 inches back along the frame to grey tank which is mid ship. That’s about three feet from the break.

I also moved insulation away from the foreword cross member. And cleaned insulation off of the sewer line which come from front of trailer drivers side.

That was a messy job. Safety glasses and a 1 inch putty knife were the best tools. Embedded in the insulation I found 12 volt wiring, propane connections, and sink drain going to gray tank.

I was encouraged after removing insulation from sewer line that there was about 1/4 inch of space between it and the frame.

Now that I have things uncovered it makes it easier to see what needs to be done.
That insulation was 5 inches thick in places and averaged 3.5 thickness.

The insulation appeared to be different layers , there was a dense 1 inch layer next to the fiberglass which was cream colored and 4-5 inches of foam which was shaded color.

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by ghosthunter

I was encouraged after removing insulation from sewer line that there was about 1/4 inch of space between it and the frame.

That's not likely enough space for welding. Cutting the sewer line fore and aft of the welding area and then reconnecting it with flexible couplings might be required.

Ron

[ghosthunter]

Originally Posted by Ron in BC

That's not likely enough space for welding. Cutting the sewer line fore and aft of the welding area and then reconnecting it with flexible couplings might be required.

Ron

And there lies the problem. It’s the coupling coming out of the tank elbow that is in the way. If it has to be removed it’s a mess because my Rv shop did not think it could be reconnected .
If it were further towards back a flexible sleeve would work.
Thus the welding fab shop. If there is a way these guys can do it. I have used them through my work many times over 28 years. They were confident they could fix it. So we will see tomorrow.

Escape could have dropped 2 or three inches out of the tank and it would be easier. But they did not do that.

[ghosthunter]

Now that my trailer is in the shop. And having the entire frame forward of the gray tank repaired and reinforced. I am thinking ahead to replacing the insulation that had to remove for the work to be completed.

I will have approx.a area 12 inches by 10 ft. To replace and about 4 ft of sewer line to cover.

Anyone re done foam under their trailer?

[Ron in BC]

I'm not sure that anyone has re-done a lot of their underneath foam but there's been conversations about spraying foam on a used trailer that didn't have any foam.

I think that there's lot's of companies that do spray foam. They might not all be enthusiastic about a small job under a trailer but they're worth calling.

But show us the finished repair before you cover it up.

Ron

[Chasing Trials]

Originally Posted by ghosthunter

Now that my trailer is in the shop. And having the entire frame forward of the gray tank repaired and reinforced. I am thinking ahead to replacing the insulation that had to remove for the work to be completed.

I will have approx.a area 12 inches by 10 ft. To replace and about 4 ft of sewer line to cover.

Anyone re done foam under their trailer?

I'm pretty sure they are using the 2 part spray foam kits. I did the walls in my house with it. Cures hard. I used this company



https://foamitgreen.com/product/foam...-type=Standard


I'm not sure if someone else has a smaller set up. Or if you can think of where in your house you could use up the rest.

[ghosthunter]

Originally Posted by Ron in BC

I'm not sure that anyone has re-done a lot of their underneath foam but there's been conversations about spraying foam on a used trailer that didn't have any foam.

I think that there's lot's of companies that do spray foam. They might not all be enthusiastic about a small job under a trailer but they're worth calling.

But show us the finished repair before you cover it up.

Ron

Picked the trailer up today. My instructions were to mend the break, extending past it on both sides. Than beef up and the frame.

I am satisfied with how it turned out. Most likely stronger than when it was made.

Before photo showing mend to get me home.

2 nd photo after new repair and beefing up.

Hard to see is metal plate both side break on side of frame.
Than steel support under frame.
Than angled steel frame support.
Than 1\8 steel plate gusset.
Stabilizers were removed cross member side to side was beefed up and stabilizers put back.

Both side of trailer .

[ghosthunter]

The wire hanging down will be re-routed.

[rubicon327]

Originally Posted by ghosthunter

Picked the trailer up today. My instructions were to mend the break, extending past it on both sides. Than beef up and the frame.

I am satisfied with how it turned out. Most likely stronger than when it was made.

Before photo showing mend to get me home.

2 nd photo after new repair and beefing up.

Hard to see is metal plate both side break on side of frame.
Than steel support under frame.
Than angled steel frame support.
Than 1\8 steel plate gusset.
Stabilizers were removed cross member side to side was beefed up and stabilizers put back.

Both side of trailer .

Nice work. Better than new.

[Iowa Dave]

As we used to say about a good strengthening job
She’s Hell for stout now.
Iowa Dave

[Doug2000]

Originally Posted by HABBERDABBER

It just takes getting the right skilled welder to cobble the patches.

I don't think I have ever cobbled in a patch in 25 years of welding. lol