Filling water tank-again.

Bobbie54 · 03-10-2021, 08:35 AM

So- anode back in the hot water tank, bypass unbypassed, I tried to fill tanks.

At first seemed like nothing happened. I noticed checking the level that the fresh tank had a drip from the valve so fixed that, it seemed to change something and I started getting water to go in. Hot water tank eventually filled, fresh showed two lights. (Which apparently is not much.)

Drove to campground. Flushed toilet 2x, no cold water now, shows empty. Hot ran with pump on a little but no cold. (Hot water faucet- I never turned the heater on.)

Borrowed water containers for the rest of the trip, two days.

The only other time I've tried to fill the tank I had the same problem, ended up with a friend's help filling from a 5 gallon jug using a siphon.

So what's the trick? Water just runs back out when I try to fill with a hose (not tons of pressure but running steadily.)

Also- pump on or off while filling? (I've heard both.)

cpaharley2008 · 03-10-2021, 08:42 AM

Only time the pump is "on" would be if in use, otherwise mine is off. I suggest you try hooking up to water and checking all valves and try to refill tank.

rubicon327 · 03-10-2021, 09:02 AM

Bobbie: Forgive me if I'm going too basic. I just want to make sure we understand the same principles about how the water system works. The hot water heater tank is 6 gallons and will fill only one of two ways - connecting to city water (pressurized) connection which fills the entire system downstream of the pump. The integral pump check valve keeps city water from backfeeding through the pump and filling the fresh water tank. The other way to fill the HWH tank is to fill the fresh water tank first through the gravity fill port and then run the water pump to fill the entire hot and cold water system including the hot water tank. You should have good flow at each faucet after the air is evacuated. This takes a few minutes since the pump is ~3 gpm and the system total is 6+ gallons if the water heater is not bypassed. You can test that the HWH is full by lifting up slightly on the pressure relief valve outside near top front of water heater (never do this after HWH has been running as water will be hot and at a higher pressure in tank)

All that said the water should go easily into the fresh water gravity fill port to fill the fresh tank. It sounds like you may have a blockage or kink but that would be pretty rare because it is a large diameter tube. Is there a way to take a flexible tube or something and try to "snake" the fill tube? If the tube you are using is long enough it should go all the way to the tank. As I write this I realized that your tank vent may have a blockage. That would keep water from going in easily because the air cannot come out. From inside the trailer do you see a small clear tube that is the tank vent line? Make sure it is not blocked or kinked. You might even be able to blow some compressed air in from the outside vent hole to clear it out. You should feel air coming out of the fill hole if the circuit is clear. Or blow air into the fill hole and try to feel it coming out the vent. Just some thoughts...

**Donna D.** · 03-10-2021, 09:03 AM

When you winterize, you put the fresh water tank into bypass. Did you change the direction of the valve so the fresh water tank would fill?

rubicon327 · 03-10-2021, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donna D.

When you winterize, you put the fresh water tank into bypass. Did you change the direction of the valve so the fresh water tank would fill?

Donna: Please clarify. The fresh water tank is never "bypassed". Only the hot water heater.

Bobbie54 · 03-10-2021, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Only time the pump is "on" would be if in use, otherwise mine is off. I suggest you try hooking up to water and checking all valves and try to refill tank.

I have been fine on city water, everything works. It's getting the fresh tank to fill that's the issue. (Problems occurred before and after city water use- though after was also after winterizing.)

Bobbie54 · 03-10-2021, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubicon327

Bobbie: Forgive me if I'm going too basic. I just want to make sure we understand the same principles about how the water system works. The hot water heater tank is 6 gallons and will fill only one of two ways - connecting to city water (pressurized) connection which fills the entire system downstream of the pump.
The integral pump check valve keeps city water from backfeeding through the pump and filling the fresh water tank.

That method works just fine.

Quote:

The other way to fill the HWH tank is to fill the fresh water tank first through the gravity fill port and then run the water pump to fill the entire hot and cold water system including the hot water tank. You should have good flow at each faucet after the air is evacuated. This takes a few minutes since the pump is ~3 gpm and the system total is 6+ gallons if the water heater is not bypassed. You can test that the HWH is full by lifting up slightly on the pressure relief valve outside near top front of water heater (never do this after HWH has been running as water will be hot and at a higher pressure in tank)

All that said the water should go easily into the fresh water gravity fill port to fill the fresh tank. It sounds like you may have a blockage or kink but that would be pretty rare because it is a large diameter tube. Is there a way to take a flexible tube or something and try to "snake" the fill tube? If the tube you are using is long enough it should go all the way to the tank. As I write this I realized that your tank vent may have a blockage. That would keep water from going in easily because the air cannot come out. From inside the trailer do you see a small clear tube that is the tank vent line? Make sure it is not blocked or kinked. You might even be able to blow some compressed air in from the outside vent hole to clear it out. You should feel air coming out of the fill hole if the circuit is clear. Or blow air into the fill hole and try to feel it coming out the vent. Just some thoughts...

Gravity fill is the problem. I will have to try a longer flexible hose. It starts to run back out immediately. I finally got it to fill the hot tank (water out the vent hole) and lights said some fresh (supposedly half which should have been plenty.) I had both hot and cold running, just apparently a lot less cold than I thought. It worked fine with no pressure gravity fill via siphon but I don't remember how long that hose was.

All that took me at least 30 minutes. I think next time maybe I'll use the city connection to fill the hot tank and then try the gravity fill for fresh.

Where is this vent? When you say "from inside the trailer" inside where? By the hot tank? where does it vent to? I had a faucet open so the vent should not have mattered.

Water is off in the campground but for one potable faucet near the dump so maybe after I dump I'll see if the long cutoff fresh hose there will put any water in my tank.

**Donna D.** · 03-10-2021, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubicon327

Donna: Please clarify. The fresh water tank is never "bypassed". Only the hot water heater.

When I use the fresh water connection to 'pump' anti-freeze through the plumbing, I turn the water heater to by pass, and also the fresh water tank to by pass. Otherwise both will fill with anti-freeze. Let me see if I can find a pic.

Bobbie54 · 03-10-2021, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donna D.

When I use the fresh water connection to 'pump' anti-freeze through the plumbing, I turn the water heater to by pass, and also the fresh water tank to by pass. Otherwise both will fill with anti-freeze. Let me see if I can find a pic.

I did hot water tank bypass but not fresh- no idea how to do that- but maybe it is partly closed... worth a check.

rubicon327 · 03-10-2021, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobbie54

Gravity fill is the problem. I will have to try a longer flexible hose. It starts to run back out immediately. I finally got it to fill the hot tank (water out the vent hole) and lights said some fresh (supposedly half which should have been plenty.) I had both hot and cold running, just apparently a lot less cold than I thought. It worked fine with no pressure gravity fill via siphon but I don't remember how long that hose was.

If a longer hose into the gravity fill is working then I still suspect a tank vent line restriction. The longer hose may be creating more area for air to escape back up and out the gravity fill line. When your fresh tank is completely full water should come spraying out the vent port (and will hit you if you aren't standing to the side).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobbie54

All that took me at least 30 minutes. I think next time maybe I'll use the city connection to fill the hot tank and then try the gravity fill for fresh.

Something is definitely wrong. It should not take anywhere near that long to fill the fresh tank and entire water system if everything is working properly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobbie54

Where is this vent? When you say "from inside the trailer" inside where? By the hot tank? where does it vent to? I had a faucet open so the vent should not have mattered.

A faucet being open is not going to help. That is on the other side of the pump. The fresh water tank has a direct vent to the outdoors for a reason. The air must expel for the tank to fill. The vent opening is on the exterior integral to the city water / gravity fill faceplate (see pic for example). Look close and you will see it. Inside the trailer the vent line is a small diameter clear plastic tube that is zip tied to the gravity water fill line (see pic). On a 17B the tank fill/vent line appear to be right next to the hot water but towards the rear of the trailer. The photo I show is a 19.

Bobbie54 · 03-10-2021, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubicon327

If a longer hose into the gravity fill is working then I still suspect a tank vent line restriction. The longer hose may be creating more area for air to escape back up and out the gravity fill line. When your fresh tank is completely full water should come spraying out the vent port (and will hit you if you aren't standing to the side).

Something is definitely wrong. It should not take anywhere near that long to fill the fresh tank and entire water system if everything is working properly.

A faucet being open is not going to help. That is on the other side of the pump. The fresh water tank has a direct vent to the outdoors for a reason. The air must expel for the tank to fill. The vent opening is on the exterior integral to the city water / gravity fill faceplate (see pic for example). Look close and you will see it. Inside the trailer the vent line is a small diameter clear plastic tube that is zip tied to the gravity water fill line (see pic).

I'll check that, thanks.

UncleTim · 03-10-2021, 10:06 AM

Also check to see if the pump itself is in bypass mode (so it can suck up antifreeze out of the little hose).

Make sure the fresh water tank is closed at the bottom of the tank, on the outside of the trailer. Make sure you know the gravity feed (left side, no screw in threads) as opposed to the city water hook up (right side with screw threads).

Test the system completely at home. I realize some of this has been stated, at least partially.

rubicon327 · 03-10-2021, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobbie54

I'll check that, thanks.

When you check the fresh water tank vent line (which should be at driver's side rear) make sure that Escape didn't zip tie it too tight to the fill line. If they crushed/kinked the plastic tube it will be restricting the proper venting of the tank. I could see this easily being done given the installation method of this vent line.

gbaglo · 03-10-2021, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobbie54

Water is off in the campground but for one potable faucet near the dump so maybe after I dump I'll see if the long cutoff fresh hose there will put any water in my tank.

I would not use that "cutoff" hose to fill your potable water tank. Who knows what other campers have used it for. Use your own fresh water hose.
Here's the inside of my 17B. You can see a small clear hose zip-tied to the fill hose.

flynfrfun · 03-10-2021, 10:31 AM

Hi Bobbie...if for some reason you can't figure this out I would be happy to help troubleshoot. But you would have to tow it to my place in Bonney Lake.

Sounds like you filled your fresh water tank, but then filled the water heater out of it which took you from 20gals fresh to 14 (assuming you got the fresh full). But then you said your fresh tank valve was dripping. Sounds like the fresh tank drain valve (the little white valve at the bottom of the fresh tank) may be partially open leaking out your fresh water while you were on the way to the campground. This explains why when you got to the campsite you flushed toilet twice and ran out of cold water but was able to get a little out of the hot because the water heater had water still in it.

Bobbie54 · 03-10-2021, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gbaglo

I would not use that "cutoff" hose to fill your potable water tank. Who knows what other campers have used it for. Use your own fresh water hose.
Here's the inside of my 17B. You can see a small clear hose zip-tied to the fill hose.

Well, can't get to that hose now as I'll have to move the mattress. So that's an at-home job.

But...when I blew thing lines out in November that vent vented. (Blown out via city hookup.)

Bobbie54 · 03-10-2021, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flynfrfun

Hi Bobbie...if for some reason you can't figure this out I would be happy to help troubleshoot. But you would have to tow it to my place in Bonney Lake.

Sounds like you filled your fresh water tank, but then filled the water heater out of it which took you from 20gals fresh to 14 (assuming you got the fresh full). But then you said your fresh tank valve was dripping. Sounds like the fresh tank drain valve (the little white valve at the bottom of the fresh tank) may be partially open leaking out your fresh water while you were on the way to the campground. This explains why when you got to the campsite you flushed toilet twice and ran out of cold water but was able to get a little out of the hot because the water heater had water still in it.

It didn't leak after I got here but I wondered about maybe a slight leak increased by vibrations-the reason I might try adding some before I leave. But I never filled the fresh tank full because it takes so long to add any water at all.

gbaglo · 03-10-2021, 11:16 AM

Have you got stuff stored in that compartment where the fresh water filler is? Perhaps it has kinked the vent hose. Tammy told me, back in 2008, not to use that compartment for storage.

Bobbie54 · 03-10-2021, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gbaglo

Have you got stuff stored in that compartment where the fresh water filler is? Perhaps it has kinked the vent hose. Tammy told me, back in 2008, not to use that compartment for storage.

No, not a single thing goes there except the power cord.

Greg and Kathy · 03-10-2021, 12:11 PM

Only a few things can go wrong
First are you filling with a hose in the city water port. If so that will not fill fresh tank. You need to use the other gravity port.
If water rushes back out you are either full or you have a kink in the hose that is going from the port to tank. It’s that simple to fill the fresh tank

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