Frameless Windows and Maxxfan

[rmitch]

Originally Posted by rmitch

Windows are a personal choice ( they all work ). I got frameless thermal.
Maxxfan is a necessity . When you need it you'll be glad you got it. It is not loud.

I should have added awnings are a personal choice also. I got Electric and love it!

[cpaharley2008]

But you can not easily replace your wind sensor with new batteries, can you now?...........

[rmitch]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

But you can not easily replace your wind sensor with new batteries, can you now?...........

All part of that " Personal Choice "

[LaurieB]

Originally Posted by Perryb67

Zero regrets!

We camp in the shoulder seasons and it rains. Sometimes it rains and rains and rains and rains. Manual awnings are simple, have been improved over the years, and are cheaper. Besides, I don't think there will be an electric problem.

The only problem people with the "other" awning come up with is on rare occasions (one? two?) the manual has unrolled going down the road. Ours never have, but they those with the "other" awning need to find a flaw, but that's really it. Just start searching for electric, wind, and retraction problems with the "other" awning. You'll have plenty of reading.

It does take about 3 minutes to deploy the manual and less than 2 minutes to retract. Works for us. Then lets not even get into the physics of the strength of the two options.

We do have a wind sensor though. When she says, "Retract the awning!" I retract the awning. Although the sensor has seen a few years, she is still fully functional!

Enjoy,

Perry

Thanks Perry! If I need a "wind sensor" for our old trailer's manual awning, I'll give your wive a call. LOL

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by LaurieB

I like a manual awning too ... Let it rain, I'm covered!!

It's not just for rain, it can be pouring buckets, torrential rain and the manual awning stays out. No having to put a pole up in the middle to keep it from collapsing. Those sliders, that we all know can't be open in rain, do just fine with the awning either fully or partly out.

And wind, no need for a wind sensor and an awning that goes in and out like a yo-yo. If we're set up for several days we put the legs out, straight up and down, peg them and put the floppy stoppers on. There it stays unless conditions get really crazy.

I view the manual awning as a full time awning. Not an awning that can't handle torrential rain and wind. Being able to retract by pushing a button does have a price.

Ron

[cpaharley2008]

But the manual awning only protects one window, the kitchen in the E21, the frameless do not need an awning anytime. In addition your awning is for shade, not rain, and any damage from use in rain is not a warranty issue.

[gbaglo]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

In addition your awning is for shade, not rain, and any damage from use in rain is not a warranty issue.

We don't get sun in BC. We get rain, and lots of it. My awning is coming up on 12 years old and has been used mainly to shelter from the rain. It's just fine, and what's the length of such a warranty anyway?
If I ever get another trailer ( unlikely ), it will have a manual awning, unless I've had my arms amputated.

[arniesea]

We have the auto awning and use it in the rain all the time, no problem. The trick is to only open it about 3 feet when rain is expected. To the point where "elbow" of the two arms are in the center of the deployment. In that position they form a center line ridge so there is no rain collection causing a failure. 3 feet is enough to take off ones rain coat, etc while entering and to dry off the dog's paws.

I had a manual awning on my E19 so I have experience with both. Again it comes down to one's camping style. We do quite a few "one night stands" on long journeys to distant destinations where we then have extended stays. I love the convenience of the automatic awning for those quick setups. To each their own.

[Vermilye]

Well, since we kinda got away from the windows & fan, and into the awning, I have to comment on the electric awning. Even after changing to the extended guides Reace sent me, I had the awning jam against the guide twice. The replacement part on the awning isn't difficult to do, but difficult to order, and you have to buy them in pairs (left & right) even if you only need one. I sure wish the manual awning was available when I purchased my trailer in 2017. I miss the tilting capability, both for water runoff & for low angle sun shade.

As to the windows & fan, I have the frames windows & manual Maxxfan. I like both, although for the vertically challenged, the remote version of the fan might make more sense, particularly with the 5.0. I have had the dreaded bathroom window failure, and will be pulling it & gluing it back together if the weather ever gets out of the 40's.

[Perry Butler]

Originally Posted by Vermilye

As to the windows & fan, I have the frames windows & manual Maxxfan. I like both, although for the vertically challenged, the remote version of the fan might make more sense, particularly with the 5.0.

The Maxxfan is easy to reach in the 5.0. It's above the steps.

Enjoy,

Perry

[LaurieB]

Originally Posted by LuGreen

In the process of spec-ing out 5.0. Still am undecided on the damn windows. I have read all of the posts on the topic and have seen that people will use the Maxxfan to aid ventilation. Can someone comment on the noise level of the fan? I assume the fan is standard option?

Thanks so much!

Hello LuGreen.
To get back on topic and answer your question about the MaxxFan, check out the live stream video Escape has just archived for the 19 Escape. They discuss the fan's operation and turn it on. You'll hear how quiet it actually is at a lower speed and what it sounds like at the highest speed.

I hope this link works:
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/619186090

[J&B Mitt]

Originally Posted by Vermilye

I have had the dreaded bathroom window failure...

We've had TWO failures of our bathroom window, but our identical kitchen window has never been a problem.
Any reason that BATHROOM windows might be more prone than kitchen windows?

Our 19 was finished in May '17. First window failed immediately.
The replacement was installed at ETI from their stock in September '17. It failed within a year. (They sent me yet another window under warranty; I haven't installed it yet.)
Is it only the 'bathroom'-sized windows that failed?

Hopefully, the window failures are limited to a batch manufactured in early 2017?

[brightday]

Originally Posted by Ron in BC

And wind, no need for a wind sensor and an awning that goes in and out like a yo-yo. If we're set up for several days we put the legs out, straight up and down, peg them and put the floppy stoppers on. There it stays unless conditions get really crazy.

Pegs and floppy stoppers? Could you please elaborate or provide a pic? Thanks!

[cpaharley2008]

Pegs to pound in the ground for the awning arms or tie downs and awning deflapper attach to the horizontal side arms to keep the awning from flapping in the wind

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by brightday

Pegs and floppy stoppers? Could you please elaborate or provide a pic? Thanks!

The only photo that I have that shows both is an old one with my 19.

The legs detach and can be moved outboard, either vertically or in this case at an angle to hold the sun shade at a good angle.

The bases have holes and I use a couple of 12" spikes as "tent pegs". Even if it's rocky they go in. With the legs secured to the ground it can get pretty breezy without any worry.

The floppy stopper is the black object at the edge of the awning. With them tensioned up the awning can stay up in a pretty good breeze.

Ron

[LuGreen]

Originally Posted by davidmurphy02

If you search the forum you'll find endless discussions about frameless windows vs. framed sliders. Previously ETI had non-thermal sliding windows as standard but they have upgraded to thermal sliders as standard now with the frameless windows as an option.

When the frameless windows were introduced several years ago, early models had a significant incidence of problems with the two panes of glass separating. Hehr, the original manufacturer, was bought out by Lippert and the production moved to a different facility. Since then it seems that delamination problems have been pretty rare, so I don't think this is really much of an issue with current production.

The frameless windows are hinged at the top and open awning-style so they can be left open in the rain. This was a big factor for us, being able to leave the trailer and have windows open for air circulation for our cats. They don't open wide - perhaps 3" or so - but we have found that they allow for plenty of ventilation. Between having several windows open or even just one and the Maxxfan running it isn't hard to get a good volume of air circulation. Some people prefer the clean, single panel exterior appearance of the frameless windows over the sliders which have a metal frame showing.

The sliders can certainly open very wide, fully open the opening size is almost half the window. This means that blowing rain could come in, so you probably don't want to leave the trailer with windows open. On a 5.0TA, if you go with the framed slider windows, the windows in the bunk area are fixed panels and do not open. However, even with the frameless windows we find that we don't open the bedroom windows often, the large escape hatch in the ceiling provides excellent ventilation and we use that when we want fresh air to flow through the bedroom. Also, with the framed slider window option, the large rear dinette window is a single fixed panel that does not open. That could be a drawback, but is nice in another way - it has no screen, and no vertical bar dividing the panel in half like the rear frameless window has, so the view out the back would be more unobstructed.

One thing to bear in mind is that if you go with the sliders, there will actually only be two sliding windows on the 5.0TA that open - the kitchen window and the passenger side dinette. On either option, the driver side dinette window is an awning-style escape hatch.

Another consideration is the awning. With frameless windows and a manual awning, the rear awning arm comes down in front of the dinette window and it can not be opened unless the awning is extended. That's not as big a deal as it sounds since with the frameless windows your rear window would be able to be opened if the awning was blocking the side window.

Both types of windows have their advantages and disadvantages - it's not a matter of which is best, but rather which suits your camping style and preferences.

Great breakdown of the considerations David. The fact that the framed windows do not not open in the bunk area resulting in only two windows that slide is what I needed to make my decision. It is the frameless for me. Thanks everyone for chiming in!

Lu Anne

[felix2]

In the livestream, Karl said that you could mix the framed and frameless windows...so for example if you really prefer the framed, but want the rear to open, you could put the frameless in the rear only. He mentioned it would look odd, but I don't think so; it's a different plane/side all to itself, not as obvious as mixing types on one side of the trailer.

[felix2]

Originally Posted by Ron in BC

The only photo that I have that shows both is an old one with my 19.

The legs detach and can be moved outboard, either vertically or in this case at an angle to hold the sun shade at a good angle.

The bases have holes and I use a couple of 12" spikes as "tent pegs". Even if it's rocky they go in. With the legs secured to the ground it can get pretty breezy without any worry.

The floppy stopper is the black object at the edge of the awning. With them tensioned up the awning can stay up in a pretty good breeze.

Ron

Hey, thanks for posting this - I hadn't realized the arms would do that, looks very stable.

[Ron in BC]

It is very stable in that configuration and since it can stay out for longer amounts of time then the electric one a sunshade or mesh can be attached. There's a groove for that purpose.

Ron

[davidmurphy02]

Originally Posted by felix2

In the livestream, Karl said that you could mix the framed and frameless windows...so for example if you really prefer the framed, but want the rear to open, you could put the frameless in the rear only. He mentioned it would look odd, but I don't think so; it's a different plane/side all to itself, not as obvious as mixing types on one side of the trailer.

That's an excellent point - previously Escape would absolutely not mix and match windows, but now apparently they will do that. Of course, now you have even more possible combinations to decide between....