Kitchen Sink Hepvo Install

[gbaglo]

Have you used Odorlos in the grey tank?

[AllanEdie]

Originally Posted by elongest

Little House Customs sells them for $26.50 & shipping.

Just ordered two from: https://www.vintagetrailersupply.com/. They had the best price and lowest shipping cost I found.

[tdf-texas]

Originally Posted by Red Dog

Our smell seems to be coming from this area in the closet of our 2017 21’ TT. I am going to start trying to keep a log of when the smell occurs, because it is not consistent.

Fred M.

Our trailer has a smell in the closet sometimes too. And we don't have socks in there. I intend to take a detailed look at the vent piping soon - first I have to remove the paneling in the back of the bottom cabinet to be able to get to it.

If you can, try to note whither the smell is stronger in the microwave cavity or the cabinet below the closet. That would be where the two ends of the vent hose would connect.

[Eggscape]

Originally Posted by AllanEdie

Just ordered two from: https://www.vintagetrailersupply.com/. They had the best price and lowest shipping cost I found.

Thanks in the research for Canadian buyers.

[AnglingMad]

This looks a no brainer, excellent job.

We are in final stages of spec/pricing a new 21 for delivery in May 2019. It makes sense to me to get them to do it during our build. So I will be asking ETI to do so. I can't see why they should object on leakage grounds as these are installed all over the world without issue providing the correct install process is followed.

[cpaharley2008]

I'd be surprised they will do that, but if successful, please let the forum know.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by AnglingMad

We are in final stages of spec/pricing a new 21 for delivery in May 2019. It makes sense to me to get them to do it during our build. So I will be asking ETI to do so. I can't see why they should object on leakage grounds as these are installed all over the world without issue providing the correct install process is followed.

I would be surprised if they are willing, and not on the grounds of leakage...

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

I don't think anyone will care if they meet Canadian residential plumbing codes. Escape does follow the applicable CSA standard (CSA Z240; as required by most provinces for new RVs, but not a federal requirement, not needed for owner modifications, and probably not enforced anywhere by anyone).

I went looking for a reference to the CSA standard, planning to note that it is available for purchase but not publicly available, when I found that the CSA Z240 standard for Recreational Vehicles is now available for free view access by the public.

The relevant part of the standard appears to be CSA Z240.3.2-14 Plumbing requirements for recreational vehicles, section 4.4 Traps, cleanouts, and fixture drains, and section 4.5 Prohibited fittings and practices. It does say

A Hepvo valve would not meet this requirement, and it might also violate section 4.5.3 (which is a prohibition of devices which restrict flow more than normal friction), but it doesn't appear to be specifically prohibited.

I think it is understandable if Escape Trailer Industries is not willing to install Hepvo valves, but if owners want to retrofit them I don't see a problem.

(This is from one of the several previous discussions of the Hepvo valve)

Code compliance issues are usually somewhat flexible, and can change with time. Reace would presumably know - or could check - the current status.

[AnglingMad]

Thanks for posting the history of the Hepvo mod. I was not aware of the compliance issue so will avoid misunderstandings in my conversation with ETI.

[Eggscape]

In my searches I ran across this today.

It looks like it works on the same theory using a silicone valve, only this one is placed right in the drain and held in by a stainless steel ring.

I like that you can see it and keep track that it is working correctly. I also like that it can easily be replaced if it is not working. At less than $3 each the replacement is not going to break the bank.

It will be a while before I do the mod so I thought I would post here for anyone interested in trying this in the near future.

[tdf-texas]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

I would be surprised if they are willing, and not on the grounds of leakage...

(This is from one of the several previous discussions of the Hepvo valve)

Code compliance issues are usually somewhat flexible, and can change with time. Reace would presumably know - or could check - the current status.

The Hepvo has CSA certification.

https://hepvo.com/wp-content/uploads...CORD_Oct18.pdf

[WaltP]

Nice mod Tom. I installed 3 Hepvos in my last Casita and one in my Bigfoot so I'm a big fan. And of course one big benefit is one less p-trap to run dry or freeze. I haven't done any on my Escape yet, but now you've inspired me.

Walt

[Red Dog]

Originally Posted by tdf-texas

If you can, try to note whither the smell is stronger in the microwave cavity or the cabinet below the closet. That would be where the two ends of the vent hose would connect.

Tom, the last time we had the smell, it came from the cabinet above the microwave cavity. That was a couple of weeks ago.



Fred M.

[richardr]

Disregard, I posted this on the wrong thread.

[AuthorSP]

Originally Posted by AnglingMad

This looks a no brainer, excellent job.

We are in final stages of spec/pricing a new 21 for delivery in May 2019. It makes sense to me to get them to do it during our build. So I will be asking ETI to do so. I can't see why they should object on leakage grounds as these are installed all over the world without issue providing the correct install process is followed.

Did you have any luck with this?

[tdf-texas]

It seems that we never stop learning - we just get older.

The installation of a S trap is illegal in the United States. The kitchen sink in Escapes are installed using a S trap.

https://www.howtolookatahouse.com/Bl...a-problem.html

The installation of a Hepvo valve for the kitchen sink meets US plumbing code.

[rbryan4]

Originally Posted by tdf-texas

It seems that we never stop learning - we just get older.

The installation of a S trap is illegal in the United States. The kitchen sink in Escapes are installed using a S trap.

https://www.howtolookatahouse.com/Bl...a-problem.html

The installation of a Hepvo valve for the kitchen sink meets US plumbing code.

Of course, buuilding codes only apply to RVs insomuch that their standards have been adopted by the RV industry regulatory body. In the US, that would be the RVIA. They follow NFPA 1192, section 7 when it comes to plumbing requirements - and yes - according to that section, an S-trap is prohibited.

Escape being a Canadian RV builder doesn't use the RVIA standard, but their standard is similar.

[tdf-texas]

Originally Posted by rbryan4

Escape being a Canadian RV builder doesn't use the RVIA standard, but their standard is similar.

Actually, Escape is required to meet RVIA standards because they import to the US. The only way to get around RVIA standards for Escape would be to manufacture two versions of the trailer - one to meet Canada standards and one for US export.

edit: Donna D corrected me rightly - The standards that have to be met are NFPA 1192 and not RVIA.

NFPA 1192 Standard on Recreational Vehicles

7.4.4.4 Full “S” traps, bell traps, drum traps, and crown*vented traps shall be prohibited.

7.6.6 AntiSiphon Trap Vent Devices. An antisiphon trap vent device shall be permitted to be used only as a secondary vent in accordance with the following:
(6) The device shall be installed in an accessible location that permits a free flow of air.

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by tdf-texas

Actually, Escape is required to meet RVIA standards because they import to the US.

Why? RVIA is not a government authority. It's an association that a manufacturer pays to join. And ETI isn't a member. But then neither is Scamp or Casita. Oliver is though.

I think RVIA is a joke. THEY decide what the standards are and have no authority to back it up. Follow the money!


I even made a sticker!

[Centex]

Just FYI, pics of my August 2021 build 5.0 showing continued installation of the "S" trap by ETI. Perhaps they favor it because it leaves more open space in the upper cabinet than if a "P" trap were installed (?). Please note in the upper-cabinet view the apparently 'not-plumb' vertical drainline is actually plumb - the 'angle' is due to wide-angle lens distortion.

IMO, regardless of codes or requirements applicable to trailers, an "S" trap has the risk of undesirable performance characteristics that make them verboten by some authorities. Mine will get the Hepvo mod when the sink is upgraded.

The use of the flex-coupler seen on the drain at the bottom may be a recently implemented improvement by ETI?

[tdf-texas]

Originally Posted by Donna D.

Why? RVIA is not a government authority. It's an association that a manufacturer pays to join. And ETI isn't a member. But then neither is Scamp or Casita. Oliver is though.

I think RVIA is a joke. THEY decide what the standards are and have no authority to back it up. Follow the money!


I even made a sticker!

Sorry Donna, I should have said that Escape doesn't meet NFPA 1192 which is the regulating government standard. RVIA doesn't write the standard but refers to NFPA for the standard. NFPA covers fire, plumbing, electric, etc. codes which by law govern installation standards for the US.

So yes, Escape is not a member of RVIA but are still required to meet all NFPA 1192 standards and they do not.

Here is the Oregon law reference for compliance with NFPA 1192.
https://www.rvia.org/system/files/me...munication.pdf